Wednesday, April 27, 2011

Finale, Here it is for you now!

During the final evening of the Hamburg conference, after all of the events were concluded we all sat down for our final dinner together. There was laughter and loud talking through the night. As the party started to break up into smaller groups and such, Amy Scobee and I had our parting conversation. I asked her why she was doing what she was doing. By that she understood I meant why was she speaking out about her experiences in Scientology? Did she not understand how dangerous this could be to her personally, as well as her family?  Paraphrased she said she understood there were risk involved but she didn’t care. She also said she didn’t think the Sea Org had the same ability to be destructive to ex members as they had in the past due to the amount of people leaving the movement. She felt there were few competent people left in the higher and lower levels of the Sea Org to even get the criminal activity accomplished like it use to. She made it clear to me that she did not share Marty Rathbun’s glorification or adoration of L Ron Hubbard. She had no use for L Ron’s tech and she decided to just tell the truth as she knew it. I smiled at her and she asked me the same question. Why do I bother doing it at all?

I was prepared for the question. During my 10 year hiatus from Scientology I had time to fully reconcile that issue so my answer was clear. I told Amy on the journey of life there are many roads. During my journey down the roads of life I fell into a deep hole. It took some time for me to get out of that hole so that I could continue my journey.  After getting out of the whole, the least I could do for my fellow travelers is to post a warning or danger sign pointing to the hole, so that’s why I do it. Hell I’d even been involved in a rescue effort to pull as many people out of the hole that I could. Most of the people I helped get out of the hole took off running once they could see the light of day again. As a result for far too long, far too few were involved in the rescue effort at all. I found myself extending my hand back into that hole to grab anyone out that I could. The more people I pulled out, the less help I had. People just got up and ran the hell away!

What did Amy mean when she said she didn’t think the Sea Org had the same ability to be destructive to ex members as they had in the past due to the amount of people leaving the movement?

Here is an excellent reference that stands as a model for everything Scientology truly represents when it comes to “Attack Campaigns” against a primary target. A primary target as defined in Scientology involves the utter destruction by any means necessary of a Scientology critic (journalist, protester and ex members included). A primary target also includes anyone who is a plaintiff in an adverse lawsuit against Scientology or any of its many sub forms. Collateral damage is a given for any unfortunate associated with the wrong side.

Please take the time to read this excellent Scientology model for the destruction of anyone who dares to question their authority:


If you are using an internet explorer browser, you may not be allowed to view this link. However you will be given the option to download a Mozilla Firefox browser which I recommend. I will not harm your computer and in some ways its better than internet explorer. If you need a link to download the Firefox browser, here is a link:


Bob Minton took his concerns for Scientology practices as far as he could within the highest political circles here in America. Bob also created a platform for his cause and tried to alert as many government agencies in America as he could beginning in 1996.

Bob took his concerns to the highest level of Sea Org members he could and tried to reason with them. Here is an excerpt from the above referenced time line:

May - July 1998: Mr. Minton had a series of three meetings, totaling 15 hours, with two of the top leaders of Scientology. He hoped to enter into a dialogue about ending Scientology's criminal conduct, including fraud, practicing medicine without a license, child abuse, and human rights violations. He met with Mike Rinder, the head of OSA International, and Marty Rathbun, head of the Religious Technology Center (RTC) and second in command of Scientology under its dictator, David Miscavige. Unfortunately, the Scientologists had no interest in discussing their criminal conduct. Their interest was solely to convince Mr. Minton to stop providing funds to Scientology critics. They told Mr. Minton point blank that if he would quit giving financial support to critics, Scientology would stop harassing and intimidating Mr. Minton and his friends and family. At the end of the third meeting, Mr. Minton made it clear that he would not stop his financial support until Scientology ceased destroying people's lives through fraud and criminal abuse. In response, the Scientologists intensified their campaign against him. 

It was a couple of months after the above meetings occurred when I came into the fray. So by the time I’d met Bob he was already pretty “wound out” i.e. reaching a hysteria concerning what he had gotten himself into concerning Scientology and how that was affecting his life and the lives of those he was close to. Bob just couldn’t reconcile how a predator organization like Scientology could exist without threat or sanction by government agencies that by their very existence were established to protect an unsuspecting public.

During our conversations of the first three days when I’d met Bob I asked him the same question I’d asked Amy at the conference. Why are you doing this? Why do you fight them when it’s clear you are going against something that could kill you? If there was a way Scientology could get it done without getting caught or even suspected, you could be a dead man.

 This was Bob’s reply to me:

When Bob was just a teenager, he grew up in a household with his father, mother and younger brother in Nashville, TN. The house was anything but a home. Bob told me his father drank heavily and sometimes would beat his mother and beat Bob for arguing with his father about beating his mother. He described his home life as a living hell. He said one day his mother just packed up her stuff and fled the house abandoning Bob and his younger brother to fend for themselves. Bob described his father as a strict disciplinarian and he beat Bob as he saw fit. Bob said as he grew older and stronger the day came when his drunken father tried to beat him and Bob fought back and kept on fighting back. At some point during one of the altercations Bob had with his father, his father called the police and asked them to commit Bob to a psychiatric institution for evaluation because he thought Bob was insane. Because Bob was underage and had very few rights he was taken away and locked up in a mental institution for testing and evaluation.  I don’t remember how long Bob told me he was locked up in the mental institution but no one from his immediate family tried to intervene or come to his aid. Bob said his then girlfriend’s mother came and got Bob out of the institution and agreed to take care of him and supervise him until he was an adult. Bob said he ended up living with his girlfriend’s family getting whatever jobs he could to put himself through college and help pay the bills where he lived. He told me he truly felt a family love that he had yearned for with his new family.

Bob said for as long as he’d live he didn’t think he would ever forget the feeling of utter hopelessness at being held against his will while in that institution. When Bob heard about the details of what had happened to Lisa McPherson he cried like a baby. He cried like a baby just trying to tell me about how it made him fell to think how Lisa must have felt when everyone ignored her cries because she was just “crazy.” Bob told me this was the reason why he kept on going despite the persecution Scientology was putting him through for questioning it’s authority through Marty Rathbun and Mike Rinder’s hands. It was during these initial conversations with Bob that I agreed to help him in the fight as best I could. Bob was fighting from his heart for all the right reasons so I walked with him.

From the time track provided, here is an excerpt that gives you an idea of the sophistication and dept of execution Scientology will go through to destroy an enemy:

September 28, 1998: Peter Franks, a British private investigator hired by Scientology, spread the word to many of Therese Minton's friends in England and to Mr. Minton's former business partner, Jeff Schmidt, that Therese, the Minton’s' two daughters, and Mr. Schmidt were going to be followed in order to bring pressure on Mr. Minton to stop his activities concerning Scientology.

Mr. Schmidt's office had been picketed and leafleted at this point for several weeks, as had his home, while his wife and children were there. Franks threatened to go after Mr. Schmidt's clients, one of which was the Nigerian government. Franks said they would arrange picketing of the Nigerian delegation to the International Monetary Fund (IMF) meeting in Washington, D. C., which was set for October 4-8 the next month. Franks promised that Mr. Schmidt would be caught in a web of an IRS tax investigation of Mr. Minton and in his own problems with the Inland Revenue Service, England's equivalent of the IRS. Franks said that unless Mr. Schmidt did something to help Scientology go after Mr. Minton, he would have serious trouble on his hands, since the seven-year statute of limitations had not yet run out on the activities he and Mr. Minton were engaged in together (their partnership ended in 1993.)

Franks also said that all of Therese's neighbors would be visited in Boston, and the "whole ugly scene" would be laid out for all to hear. The children's schools would be targeted for the same campaign, which would include teachers, administrators and parents, to paint Mr. Minton as a pariah. He let it be known that he expected Therese and Jeff to pressure Mr. Minton into quitting the work he was doing concerning Scientology.

July 1999: Scientology operatives broke into Jeff Schmidt's London office and photocopied extensive files. Mr. Schmidt was later told by a Scientology private investigator that if he could not convince Mr. Minton to end his opposition to Scientology, all of the files would be turned over to the Inland Revenue and the Nigerian Media. Mr. Schmidt called Mr. Minton and begged him to stop criticizing Scientology. Mr. Minton tried to convince Mr. Schmidt to go to the authorities and report Scientology's conduct as blackmail, but Mr. Schmidt was frightened of what the Scientologists would do to him and his family, and he refused.

Here is a perfect example of Scientology’s utter contempt for the law or law enforcement agencies. This is the right time and place to explain how Scientology is able to corrupt practically any government agent or agency.  It’s the untraceable money flow through the offices of high priced lawyers who then help launder the cash money paid to the field operatives and their friends. Scientology on its books carries whatever the dollar amount is paid to eliminate an “enemy” as attorney fees. The law firm carries the dollar figures on their accounting books as fees paid to a private investigator firm who then doles out the money to active law enforcement employees. The lawyers will admit to whom they paid money to for investigative services, but how that money was used and in what sums quickly become unclear. The operative theory for Scientology and its high priced lawyers is to keep as many arm lengths from the eventual victim as possible to limit liability. Simply stated, the scam is set up so that all can claim no one knows anything specific, especially those at the top doling out the money who happens to be the same people issuing the orders and paying for the service. It’s just that simple.

Through the hire of high priced influential lawyers. Scientology project operatives like Marty and Mike Rinder direct these lawyers to find the best ex cop, ex FBI or ex Sherriff or any ex law enforcement person to work for hire. The more connections the potential hire has with current active agents the better. This is the preferred method of hire because it’s easy to get cash money exchanging hands. These ex law enforcement agents have “favors” they can buy from current law enforcement friends such as providing a profile or files of anyone, public or government privilege only files as kept by any law enforcement agency. An example would be a paid ex law enforcement persons pays his friends cash for information and hands the information over to Scientology for evaluation. Driving records, cell phone records, tax information and past criminal records can be procured. This can also extend to getting law enforcement to look the other way while a crime is being committed such as a break in. Scientology also uses these contacts to procure the latest surveillance equipment for bugging devices. This is how Scientology is able to give a person that “I’m being haunted feeling.” Scientology somehow seems to know everything about the target.

After a certain amount of money has exchanged hands between Scientology and working law enforcement agents, the intended Scientology target also becomes a target for law enforcement itself by association.

Here is a link to a story the St. Petersburg Times put out concerning the “Project” Scientology had for me to illustrate the point:

http://www.sptimes.com/News/052601/Opinion/Church_behavior.shtml

During my trial, Scientology divulged it paid private investigators in access of $500,000.00 in private investigator fees alone to set me up for marijuana possession.  A few people were paid very well for that.

Here is a link to Mike Rinder’s parting shot when his “project” for me failed to get the intended results:

http://www.lermanet2.com/scientologynews/tampatribune/tampa-jesse-052601.htm

This is why any law enforcement agency that decides to investigate Scientology has the added task of investigating itself first, least Scientology play cat and mouse games for years due to infiltration in the ranks of the investigating agency.  This has already happened. When Scientology got raided by the FBI in 1977, they were tipped off by a police officer some hours before the raid occurred. At that time it was too late to try and hide files because all files were paper files. This was before the digital age of internet, digital files,  or computers. With today’s technology an early warning could make a big difference as far as what eventually is able to be discovered.

 I invite any active investigator to revisit as a study the information concerning Bernie McCabe as the prosecutor in the Lisa McPherson criminal case.  Someone should ask Marty and Mike specifically how they investigated the investigator using the influence of high priced local law firms. Some of those drunken high priced lawyers were starving for cash. Marty and Mike walked in with those huge Xmas bags of money and were able to get a lot done under the table. This is not my story to tell though. Only Marty, Mike and David Miscavige can tell the real story. 

Here is another example of how Scientology hires professionals to do criminal activities against its perceived enemies for money:

April 26, 2001: Jesse Prince received an anonymous fax at the Lisa McPherson Trust that indicated a man named David Amos might be willing to provide information to Mr. Prince about harassment of Mr. Prince by Scientology operatives. Mr. Prince was able to reach Mr. Amos by telephone. Mr. Amos agreed to meet with Mr. Prince in Memphis, Tennessee. That night, Mr. Prince drove to Memphis, accompanied by Patrick Jost, a former Treasury Department investigator who was working with the Lisa McPherson Trust to document Scientology's criminal conduct. Mr. Jost felt that Mr. Prince should not meet with Mr. Amos alone.

April 27, 2001: Mr. Amos agreed to meet with Mr. Prince alone while Mr. Jost watched them from his car less than twenty feet away. Mr. Amos told Mr. Prince that he had worked as a private investigator for Scientology from the fall of 1998 until the winter of 2000. He said that Scientology attorney Kendrick Moxon had told him that Mr. Prince and Mr. Minton were involved in a child slavery ring and that Scientology was trying to expose them to rescue the children. Mr. Amos said he felt that Moxon had told him this story in order to motivate him to commit illegal acts to try to catch Mr. Prince. Mr. Amos admitted to Mr. Prince that he had illegally wiretapped the telephone in Mr. Prince's Chicago apartment at the end of 1998. He also admitted that he had passed on information obtained via this illegal wiretap to his Scientology handlers. Mr. Amos also said that he had set up illegal surveillance equipment to monitor Mr. Prince, Ms. Brooks and Mark Bunker in their homes in Clearwater, Florida. Mr. Amos reluctantly agreed to show Mr. Prince where the surveillance equipment had been set up. However, he later refused to travel to Clearwater because he was afraid of what the Scientologists would do to him if they found out. A report of this meeting was sent to the FBI in Florida.

The time line referenced thus far was compiled and produced by Stacy Brooks before she went back to and began acting as a Scientology agent. Her version of the time track ends in August, 2001.

The following is a link to a different time track that goes beyond August, 2001. This timeline was compiled from the many hours of deposition testimony of Bob Minton which itself was a travesty of justice. Over time, Scientology is able to manufacture whatever information it needs to suit its own ends.  

http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/minton-timeline.htm

This version of a time track offered the following disclaimer as far as being able to cross reference the information:

I've read through the first four volumes of Bob Minton's testimony and
>started to put together a timeline. I have not yet attempted to cross-
>reference this information to see whether it matches other peoples'
>versions of events.

Since I was there on the scene as the end of Bob Minton unfolded, I will cross reference some of the events that happened. Here is an entry from this timeline:

2002 January - Bob Minton calls Jesse Prince and tells him that he feels suicidal (Minton 9, page 105)

By this time Bob began to realize the gravity of his situation. He felt betrayed by the very people he wanted to trust. Bob was in anguish, sobbing uncontrollably and was threatening to end his life with a shot gun blast to the head. His plan was to get into his old pickup truck and drive out into his field behind the barn, located a short distance from the front door of his house, and shot himself. We were on the phone for hours. For once, Stacy was not with him at his New Hampshire home. He said he hated Stacy for information she had disclosed to Scientology in a recent deposition she’d been ordered to attend.  He was also upset with her for the pain he felt Stacy had caused his wife and family. He felt deeply betrayed by Ken Dandar, the lead council in the Lisa McPherson case because he felt Ken had extorted him for his money. He said he hated himself the most for letting things get so out of hand. He told me he had let everyone down because he could not stand up for, or help anyone, anymore. For that reason he was just a piece of shit who was now about to kill himself.

 There was also the fact that the Scientology Legal and Intel machine was about to have Bob locked up in jail for contempt of court, perjury and other “manufactured” charges.

As mentioned above, Bob had very strong feelings about being locked up against his will for any reason. I believe the threat of being locked up was Bob’s true Achilles heel and he had reached a fork in the road.

I’m going to really try and distill the exact reason Bob was so upset with Stacy in the hopes that the concepts are simply understood. So here is what is happened.

At some point in the fall of 2001, Stacy Brooks was being deposed by Sea Organization attorney, Kendrick Moxon. Kendrick asked Stacy about her knowledge of a bank account Bob Minton maintained off shore. From what I remember, the specific account in question was established to financially maintain the Lisa McPherson Trust until the end of the Lisa McPherson civil trial. Bob was trying to take himself out of the picture in the Lisa McPherson case so the case could get to trial. We were all confident with bringing the case to trial.

Scientology had been investigating ALL of Bob’s financial sources and bank accounts for over a year.  Bob had a lot of money and he had it placed all around in banks internationally. The main mission of those investigating Bob was to find money  he had not paid taxes on in the United States. Somehow, during Stacy’s deposition she told Kendrick Moxon about an account Bob had that may have had money in it that he had not claimed or paid any taxes on. Bob had transferred money from that account to another account to keep the Trust going until the trial could be completed in the Lisa McPherson case. Bob had taken Stacy Brooks and Patrick Jost with him to Europe and exposed these accounts to them.

I remember the day it happened. Bob and Stacy came back to the Lisa McPherson trust after the deposition and Bob was furious. I’d never seem him that upset before. He was screaming at Stacy and actually got physical with her. I intervened and asked Bob what happened.

 He told me Stacy told Scientology information about his accounts that would probably land him in jail soon. Stacy said she didn’t mean to, it was a mistake and she got rattled by the questioning. Scientology was also trying to get her put in jail any way they could. They had already bounced off of me. Whatever the truth is, Bob was never the same after that.

For Bob, this had turned into a life or death situation so I guess that may have been the reason he called me about his planned suicide. We had already gone through the “life or death” drill a couple of times before. About a year earlier, Bob and I were walking and driving around his property in New Hampshire.  I think the property was at least 200 acres and included what can only be called “The woods”.  As we were headed back to the house, we ran into a swarm of wasp and one had bitten Bob on the neck. Immediately he started to bleed from the bite and his face began to swell. As we entered the house I noticed Bob seemed to have trouble catching his breath. He told me he was going into anaphylactic shock as he got some pills from his medicine cabinet and took them. Bob also retrieved a huge syringe with a substance in it and he showed me how to use it on him. He told me if he stopped breathing to inject him into his heart with the syringe but I’d have to make sure I punched through the breast bone to get the medication to his heart.  Bob had an allergy to wasp and one had stung him on the side of his neck. The way he was bleeding it seemed like he’d been cut with a knife. I told Bob it would be best if I called the ambulance now but he wouldn’t have it. He told me he was just going to lay down and if the fell asleep he wanted me to sit and watch over him to make sure he was still breathing.  Bob told me the medication that he had taken would kick in soon and he did not want to make a scene with calling 911.

So I sat there with him and watched him sleep for about 3 hours with the syringe in my hand most of the time. As he slept I could see the swelling was going down and he seemed to relax. When he woke up he was a little groggy but he put on that big smile of his and assured me he was okay now and thanked me for watching over him.

Another occasion of a life or death situation with Bob happened at a restaurant in Leipzig, Germany. Bob, myself, Stacy Brooks, Mark Bunker and whoever else was there had just began to eat our meals when Bob suddenly looked like he was having a seizure. He turned totally red and he couldn’t breathe. To say the least this was a shock to all present. I jumped out of my chair and grabbed Bob from behind and started doing the Heimlich maneuver on him. His body was rock hard, like he’d turned to stone. It may have been the third try but I felt his body relax and he took a gulp of air. I came around to face him and I could see that whatever had happened to him had passed. I asked him if he’d choked on his food, he said no. I asked him what did he think happened and he said he didn’t know. Again he refused to be taken to see a doctor. He did promise to see his regular doctor after the Leipzig trip was over. We all kept an eye on Bob for the rest of the trip. 

Back to the suicide phone call, Bob said didn’t want to talk to Stacy anymore because he felt she betrayed him when she’d told Scientology what they wanted to hear in her deposition. Stacy was devastated by Bob rejecting her and she was miserable as well. I’d asked her myself why she told Scientology about Bob’s accounts. She told me it was a mistake and she didn’t mean to do that. She also told me she was going to do whatever it took to get Bob out of and away from the stress of Scientology. She told me she was going to call Mike Rinder and work out a deal. She said she had to get Bob out of the court rooms with Scientology and I agreed. Together Stacy and I were able to get Bob to calm down and consider other options besides death.

Bob, Stacy and I had some long hard talks after the above situation calmed down. It was clear that the Lisa McPherson Trust was over. Both Stacy and I made plans to sell our homes and get the hell out of Florida. This was before Stacy called to make a “deal”.

Stacy ended up leaving Florida and going to New Hampshire with Bob to see what kind of deal could be worked out.

After Stacy and Bob started negotiating with Rinder and Rathbun they quickly let me know the negotiations were confidential and they could not discuss any details with me, but they would fill me in when they came back to Florida and so it went.

The Lisa McPherson Trust was closed during this time and the staff was put on hold. I prepared my house for sale and went about the business of home improvement. I had a family at this time, raising two young kids so a plan B was on my mind hard.

Here is a good description of what happened next, from the “other” time track:



15 Mar - Bob Minton and Stacy Brooks discuss the situation. Minton decides that it is time to settle his differences with Scientology (Minton 9, page 88).

16 Mar - Bob Minton calls Mike Rinder in Los Angeles (Minton 9, page 86). Minton tells Rinder that he feels overwhelmed by the litigation and wants to get out of it and settle any outstanding differences. Rinder agrees to call Minton back to discuss it (Minton 9, page 90). Stacy Brooks made the first call to Rinder, then Minton called about three hours later after no response from Rinder (Minton 14, page 1853).

19/20 Mar - Mike Rinder calls Bob Minton and suggests meeting in New York on 28-29 Mar. Rinder requires that Jonas and Rosen create a confidentiality agreement to prevent Minton from mentioning the discussions on the Internet, as happened last time Minton and Rinder met, in 1998 (Minton 9, pages 90-1).

20 Mar - The Church of Scientology requests an out-of-state deposition of Dresdner Bank in Los Angeles. The order is signed on 20 Mar (Minton 10, pages 1315-6).

25/26 Mar - Rosen and Jonas write a letter confirming the confidentiality agreement (Minton 9, page 91). Jonas' letter includes a clause requiring the participants to hide the discussions from the court; "without trying to anticipate all the ways in which this agreement could be violated, it is specifically agreed that the discussions will not be posted on the Internet; will not be inquired into in discovery in any litigation; and will not be revealed in any court papers or to any court." (Minton 10, page 1290). Bruce Howie enforces the confidentiality agreement during the 19 Apr hearing in front of Judge Baird, although the Church of Scientology waived the agreement (Minton 10, pages 1295-6).

28-29 Mar - Bob Minton first meets with the Church of Scientology (Minton 3, page 311). The meetings take place in New York and Minton flies back to New Hampshire afterwards (Minton 3, page 314).

Shortly after the above activity, Bob and Stacy came back to Florida and asked all of the Lisa McPherson Staff to meet them at a hotel in Tampa for a meeting. At the meeting Stacy confirmed with the staff that the Trust was over. I think there may have been a final paycheck. I met privately with Bob and Stacy to discuss the new deal. In a nutshell, Stacy told me Scientology would leave Bob alone if he complied with the following conditions:



1.      Close the Lisa McPherson Trust.

2.     End funding any and all legal cases against Scientology or its affiliates.

3.     Destroy the Lisa McPherson case by retracting testimony.

4.     Enter into a permanent agreement to end all disputes with Scientology.



Step one and two were already done by the time they came back to Florida so the priority was to get rid of the Lisa McPherson case and any other cases Bob was funding.



This turned out to be a long day and a long night. For the rest of the day we didn’t talk about the Lisa McPherson case. Bob wanted to save that for after dinner.



We had dinner that night and it seems like we talked about everything but the case until much later. After the LMT Staff members and friends had left it was just Bob, Stacy and me. It was time for real talk. I asked Bob what was going to happen with the Lisa McPherson case. He said he was not sure what was going to happen. Stacy quickly corrected him and said it had  all been worked out. She proceeded to explain to me that not only did Scientology want Bob to stop funding legal cases against Scientology like he had been. They also wanted ALL cases settled and Bob and Stacy were going to assist Scientology in any way they had to. I looked at Bob and asked him if he had joined Scientology now. He said fuck no, he said we’ll see what these fuckers got and deal with it as best he could but he was not going to jail and he was not going to have his family harmed in any more. I told him I understood that but I was unclear on what it all would mean.



Stacy then told me the rest of the deal. She told me that she and Bob were working with Scientology attorneys to draft new declarations recanting their testimony in the Lisa McPherson case.  The plan included targeting the attorney for the Lisa McPherson case Ken Dandar to get him disbarred to end his right to practice law. This is how Scientology likes to gloat when it thinks it has won hands down. The plan was for them to say Ken Dandar coerced them and gave them bad advice that amounted to perjury. Neither Bob nor Stacy was concerned about submitting a declaration to the court about perjuring themselves. Scientology owned the right judges by then and assured Bob and his attorney that there was little chance he’d go to jail for perjury. They were just going to blame everything on Ken Dandar. Did I mention that Ken had recently had a double bypass heart surgery? I’m pretty sure to this point I haven’t mention the personal hell he’d gone through at the hands of Scientology paid investigators either.  



Here is more of what was also going on at the time from a time track created from Bob Minton’s deposition testimony:



28 Mar - Bob Minton meets with the Church of Scientology. Rosen talks about Larry Wollersheim, Grady Ward, and Gerry Armstrong. Rosen also discusses these cases: the Wollersheim case, the Lisa McPherson case ("the Florida cases"), two cases in France, a libel case in Germany filed by Minton, two cases in Switzerland, and Keith Henson's activities (Minton 8, pages 1036-7). Also present are Mike Rinder, Monique Yingling, Steve Jonas (Minton 8, pages 1039-40). The Swiss cases involve Jean-Luc Barbier suing the Church of Scientology. Minton gave him $25-30,000 and provided assistance from a French lawyer, Michel Pesenti, who Minton paid $250,000 for legal services. Pesenti represented Minton, Stacy Brooks, and Jesse Prince in three libel suits in France (Minton 8, pages 1040-2). The meeting takes place in Rosen's office. Stacy Brooks is also present (Minton 10, page 1286). Minton expects that the settlement negotiations would involve him writing out a cheque to the Church of Scientology, and nothing more (Minton 10, page 1289). Rosen shows Minton a "preview copy" of the lawsuit against Gerry Armstrong, where Minton and Brooks are named as defendants. Minton is also shown a "preview copy" of the counterclaim in the Lisa McPherson case, adding him as a defendant in the counterclaim (Minton 10, pages 1326-7). Rosen also mentions that the Church of Scientology has spent approx. $20,000 on a possible RICO suit (Minton 10, pages 1327-8). Rosen says that the Church of Scientology has spent approx. $34,925,000 on the lawsuits in which Bob Minton is involved (Minton 10, page 1332). Rinder wants to discuss domain names registered to Minton that contain the word 'Scientology', mutual releases (each party agrees not to sue the other after a settlement agreement), and an agreement preventing Minton from funding anti-Scientology litigation (Minton 11, pages 1370-2). The meeting lasts from 9:00 a.m. until 3:30 or 4:00 p.m. (Minton 11, page 1374). Rinder says that before they can begin settlement talks, Minton and Brooks must travel to Florida and "set the record straight in the wrongful death case and the breach of contract case" (Minton 11, page 1384). Sometime in the afternoon, Rinder says that if Minton and Brooks set the record straight, he thinks that the wrongful death case will be dismissed (Minton 11, page 1391). Minton also asks the Church of Scientology to work out a final agreement with Grady Ward (Minton 11, pages 1403-1404). The Armstrong lawsuit is for a total of $10,050,000 ($50,000 multiplied by 201 infringements) (Minton 11, page 1405). Rinder tells Minton that Ken Dandar has purchased several properties (Minton 12, page 1528): a 200,000-square-foot warehouse in Odessa (Minton 12, pages 1524-5), a holiday home in North Carolina, two homes (one for Dandar and one for his mother) near Odessa or somewhere north of Tampa (Minton 12, page 1525).

28 Mar - Bob Minton calls Ken Dandar and asks him to set up a meeting with Dell Liebreich, Stacy Brooks, Dandar, and Minton (Minton 3, page 312).

29 Mar - Bob Minton and Stacy Brooks meet with Rosen and Rinder for a second time. The meeting lasts about an hour before Brooks accuse Rosen and Rinder of not negotiating in good faith (Minton 11, page 1385).

Rinder calls Minton about an hour after Brooks and Minton leave the meeting, telling them that the Church of Scientology is still willing to meet with them again for further talks (Minton 11, pages 1401-2).





These were Stacy’s instructions from her Scientology handlers and she had set about the task of getting it done. Stacy told me that she was going to do what she could and use whoever she could to get ALL legal cases settled.

What Stacy wanted to make clear to me is Bob was done with the Lisa McPherson case and would not support it in any way. She mentioned that I needed to start thinking about recanting my testimony in all of the legal cases that I was involved in. I didn’t react to what she was saying. I just listened. She just kept on talking but again I had tuned her talking out. I was thinking of the gravity of my situation. I’m here in Florida with a family. I was involved in at least four legal cases against Scientology.  I’m thinking these guy have been convinced to not only back off from Scientology themselves, they were also going to try and attack or destroy anyone Scientology could sic them on, especially me!



I told Stacy that I needed to talk with Mike Rinder or Marty Rathbun before I could give them an answer. Stacy said that would be arranged the following day. We all said our good nights and I went home.



I called a friend, Frank Oliver and laid out the whole scene. He was just as shocked about the situation as anyone could be. I told him I’d requested an audience with Mike and Marty and I needed to be prepared. I asked him for a miniature recording device that I could easily hide but get a good recording at the same time. I had also decided I would still support Ken Dandar in the Lisa McPherson case. Both Frank and I consulted with Ken on my plan. Frank gave me the device. I had mentally gone through as many possible scenarios as I could think of. The basic plan was to leave the meeting with a usable recording of the event. The only other problem I could think of was just me. I was a ball of nerves and conflicting emotions.



The next day I met with Bob and Stacy at the Adams Mark hotel on Clearwater Beach. I was somehow able to keep my composure so far.  Bob and Stacy had decided to move to another hotel on the beach and that was where we were to meet with Rinder and Rathbun.



Before I was able to meet with Rinder and Rathbun at the new hotel, both Stacy and Bob got in my face about really needing to work with them on my recant declarations; they made it clear that unless I complied I was going to starve along with my family.



I tried to remain calm so I just looked at them, but then I started seeing red.

Paraphrased I told Bob that he had no idea what he was asking me to do.  I asked him if he thought I was lying or trying to trick him about my Scientology experience. Did he think he had done something for me to the point that he could now bargain with Scientology for my soul? I told him he was breaking my heart and I needed a face to face with Rinder and Rathbun. I wanted to hear it from them. I let him know that I was no respecter of persons and I welcomed an opportunity to light Rinder and Rathbun’s asses up. I reminded him of what I’d told him about the last time Miscavige and Rathbun tried to force me to do anything.



14 Apr - Bob Minton and Stacy Brooks meet for dinner with Jesse Prince.

Prince tells them that he wants to meet with Mike Rinder and "get right in his face" (Minton 12, page 1593). Minton claims that Prince tells a story about how he threatened several high-ranking Scientologists (David Miscavige, Mike Rinder, and a few others) with guns (Minton 12, pages 1597-8). Minton feels threatened and tells Prince that he does not want to see him anymore (Minton 12, page 1600).

14 Apr - Bob Minton calls Mike Rinder after the meeting with Jesse Prince to warn him about Prince's threats (Minton 12, pages 1595-8).

Stacy ran off to make a phone call so I waited thinking Rathbun and Rinder were on the way. Some time had pasted and I asked Stacy if they were on the way, she said they were not coming so I left. I don’t have any memory of ever talking to Bob Minton again. The train was on the track and there was nothing more to say.

Bob and Stacy had a new team put together now. When Stacy and Bob went into negotiations with Scientology, they also brought Patrick Jost and Arnie Lerma with them.

Here is an entry from the time track compiled from Bob Minton’s deposition testimony that talks about Arnie trying to convince Lawrence Wollersheim to settle his case with Scientology:

9 Apr - Bob Minton persuades Arnie Lerma to contact Larry Wollersheim to offer to pay him approx. $200,000 personally, and forgive the $700,000 loan, if he will dismiss his case (Minton 8, pages 1018-9). Minton first discusses his idea with Dan Leipold, who tells him to talk directly with Wollersheim (Minton 8, page 1020).

I don’t know how many people reading here know or know of Lawrence Wollersheim, but the above Scientology drill proved to be a complete waste of time. Lawrence would have none of it. Lawrence is the only person I know of  in the history of litigation with Scientology that brought his case to court, won the case, got paid for his trouble and NEVER signed a confidential agreement with Scientology about anything period. Lawrence and his team (which I joined in 1998) kicked Scientology’s ass in the courts hands down. Anyone else that I know of has sold a piece of their soul for Scientology’s money by promising to keep quiet. Accepting Scientology’s money in this way in the end proves to be a sellout. By settling money for silence how can you warn others? It’s a selfish decision to know of something that actively hunts and preys on good people just like you and not warn them for money, not to mention the lifetime Scientology tether agreement is always around your neck.

The attorney for the Lawrence Wollersheim case was Dan Leipold. I can only describe Dan as being a righteous man when it came to having respect for and defending the truth. I say that in summary of the character of the man I knew as Dan Leipold who has since passed on. The true story of how he was able to legally defeat Scientology and the suffering he and his family endured will never be told because he is dead now. A firsthand account is no longer an option.

Anyway, Stacy Brooks, Mike Rinder, Bob Minton, Marty Rathbun, Arnie Lerma, Patrick Jost and a host of attorneys for all concerned set about the task of settling all of Scientology’s legal cases one way or the other. They contacted as many people as they could on Scientology’s behalf.

The reason or excuse for this new agreement to work with Scientology between these unlikely parties I suspect had something to do with saving the cash cow, Bob Minton. Bob Minton had continually given Stacy Brooks and Arnie Lerma large sums of money so they each had a vested interest as well.

19/20 Mar 2002 - Mike Rinder calls Bob Minton and suggests meeting in New York on 28-29 Mar. Rinder requires that Jonas and Rosen create a confidentiality agreement to prevent Minton from mentioning the discussions on the Internet, as happened last time Minton and Rinder met, in 1998 (Minton 9, pages 90-1).

20 Mar - The Church of Scientology requests an out-of-state deposition of Dresdner Bank in Los Angeles. The order is signed on 20 Mar (Minton 10, pages 1315-6).

25/26 Mar - Rosen and Jonas write a letter confirming the confidentiality agreement (Minton 9, page 91). Jonas' letter includes a clause requiring the participants to hide the discussions from the court; "without trying to anticipate all the ways in which this agreement could be violated, it is specifically agreed that the discussions will not be posted on the Internet; will not be inquired into in discovery in any litigation; and will not be revealed in any court papers or to any court." (Minton 10, page 1290). Bruce Howie enforces the confidentiality agreement during the 19 Apr hearing in front of Judge Baird, although the Church of Scientology waived the agreement (Minton 10, pages 1295-6).

28-29 Mar - Bob Minton first meets with the Church of Scientology (Minton 3, page 311). The meetings take place in New York and Minton flies back to New Hampshire afterwards (Minton 3, page 314).

28 Mar - Bob Minton meets with the Church of Scientology. Rosen talks about Larry Wollersheim, Grady Ward, and Gerry Armstrong. Rosen also discusses these cases: the Wollersheim case, the Lisa McPherson case ("the Florida cases"), two cases in France, a libel case in Germany filed by Minton, two cases in Switzerland, and Keith Henson's activities (Minton 8, pages 1036-7). Also present are Mike Rinder, Monique Yingling, Steve Jonas (Minton 8, pages 1039-40). The Swiss cases involve Jean-Luc Barbier suing the Church of Scientology. Minton gave him $25-30,000 and provided assistance from a French lawyer, Michel Pesenti, who Minton paid $250,000 for legal services. Pesenti represented Minton, Stacy Brooks, and Jesse Prince in three libel suits in France (Minton 8, pages 1040-2). The meeting takes place in Rosen's office. Stacy Brooks is also present (Minton 10, page 1286). Minton expects that the settlement negotiations would involve him writing out a cheque to the Church of Scientology, and nothing more (Minton 10, page 1289). Rosen shows Minton a "preview copy" of the lawsuit against Gerry Armstrong, where Minton and Brooks are named as defendants. Minton is also shown a "preview copy" of the counterclaim in the Lisa McPherson case, adding him as a defendant in the counterclaim (Minton 10, pages 1326-7). Rosen also mentions that the Church of Scientology has spent approx. $20,000 on a possible RICO suit (Minton 10, pages 1327-8). Rosen says that the Church of Scientology has spent approx. $34,925,000 on the lawsuits in which Bob Minton is involved (Minton 10, page 1332). Rinder wants to discuss domain names registered to Minton that contain the word 'Scientology', mutual releases (each party agrees not to sue the other after a settlement agreement), and an agreement preventing Minton from funding anti-Scientology litigation (Minton 11, pages 1370-2). The meeting lasts from 9:00 a.m. until 3:30 or 4:00 p.m. (Minton 11, page 1374). Rinder says that before they can begin settlement talks, Minton and Brooks must travel to Florida and "set the record straight in the wrongful death case and the breach of contract case" (Minton 11, page 1384). Sometime in the afternoon, Rinder says that if Minton and Brooks set the record straight, he thinks that the wrongful death case will be dismissed (Minton 11, page 1391). Minton also asks the Church of Scientology to work out a final agreement with Grady Ward (Minton 11, pages 1403-1404). The Armstrong lawsuit is for a total of $10,050,000 ($50,000 multiplied by 201 infringements) (Minton 11, page 1405). Rinder tells Minton that Ken Dandar has purchased several properties (Minton 12, page 1528): a 200,000-square-foot warehouse in Odessa (Minton 12, pages 1524-5), a holiday home in North Carolina, two homes (one for Dandar and one for his mother) near Odessa or somewhere north of Tampa (Minton 12, page 1525).

28 Mar - Bob Minton calls Ken Dandar and asks him to set up a meeting with Dell Liebreich, Stacy Brooks, Dandar, and Minton (Minton 3, page 312).

29 Mar - Bob Minton and Stacy Brooks meet with Rosen and Rinder for a second time. The meeting lasts about an hour before Brooks accuse Rosen and Rinder of not negotiating in good faith (Minton 11, page 1385).

Rinder calls Minton about an hour after Brooks and Minton leave the meeting, telling them that the Church of Scientology is still willing to meet with them again for further talks (Minton 11, pages 1401-2).

29 Mar - Bob Minton calls Ken Dandar and asks him to dismiss the case (Minton 3, page 309). Minton calls from New Hampshire and tells Dandar that "if we continued with this litigation the way we had been, that both of us were going to get destroyed, both Mr. Dandar and me" (Minton 3, page 314). Minton claims that he has to travel to Florida to "tell the truth" about the cheques. Minton claims that Dandar replied "You can't tell about these checks. I haven't reported them to the court"

(Minton 3, page 315). Minton claims that Dandar told him that he had "discussed it with Dell Liebreich and there was no way they were going to dismiss the case". Minton tells Dandar that the blood of his wife and children would be on Dandar's hands if he does not dismiss the case (Minton 3, page 316). Minton claims that Dandar does not want him to disclose anything about the two UBS cheques, 93G and 93I (Minton 3, page 321). Dandar offers to meet Minton and Stacy Brooks in Ohio on the following Wednesday, 3 Apr, to discuss the issues (Minton 3, pages 322-3).

30 Mar - Bob Minton calls Ken Dandar and again asks him to dismiss the case. When Dandar refuses, Minton asked him for the $250,000, cheque 93I, back (Minton 3, page 322). Dandar retracts his offer of a meeting (Minton 3, pages 326-7). Stacy Brooks also participates in the call, accusing Dandar of lying to Minton (Minton 3, page 327).

Patrick Jost was introduced to Bob Minton by Arnie Lerma. Bob needed to hire an expert concerning finances so he hired Patrick in 2000.

June 2000 - The Nigerian high commissioner in London, in a letter to a Swiss prosecutor, accuses Bob Minton of money laundering and forgery. No charges resulted from the accusations (Minton 9, pages 58-61). Minton believes that private investigator David Lee is involved in the scheme (Minton 9, page 63). Minton employs Patrick Jost, a money laundering expert and former FINCEN employee, to help him rebut the accusations (Minton 9, pages 75-8).

Bob had given money to many critics of Scientology.  Scientology had already made Bob divulge whom he had given money to that was a Scientology critic via deposition testimony. Now Scientology used Bob and his new team to attack what he had supported and had feelings for. This is how Scientology gloats in victory.

Even the judge in the Lisa McPherson case was surprised and taken aback by how drastically the court proceedings had changed. For almost 2 years, Bob, Stacy and I sat in different court rooms in Clearwater and St. Petersburg Florida as a team exposing Scientology for the last three years. The Scientology team always sat on one side of the room while we occupied the other. Now suddenly Bob Minton and Stacy Brooks are sitting on the same side as Scientology in the court room in front of the same judge as before. Stacy gleefully assisting Kendrick Moxon with whatever paperwork or preparation Scientology needed. I remember just looking at her as she smiled and joked with Moxon who was on a mission to get Ken Dandar disbarred from the Florida Bar Association.

Besides the Lisa McPherson case, I was also actively working on the Wollersheim case, the Dennis Erlich case and a case against Digital Light Wave that involved an ex Scientologist named Brian Haney. I had submitted declarations in each of these cases. With the exception of the Brian Haney case, each of the cases mentioned above had received funding from Bob Minton. Based on the entries from both timelines you can see that Bob had provided funding for many cases. That means Bob and his new team went to work to reverse the work done with each person he had helped fight Scientology financially.

It seemed like Scientology would prevail in their sweeping plan to silence all critics under threat of lawsuits forever, but that’s not how it turned out. Some people refused to cooperate with Scientology and Bob Minton’s new team and that made a difference. Dan Leipold refused to cooperate on the Wollersheim case. He went on to settle with Scientology on Lawrence Wollersheim terms which did not involve Lawrence being quiet about his Scientology experience. Ken Dandar fought for his life for as long as he could. He did not get disbarred in the end, but he did cooperate with Scientology during the final settlement of the Lisa McPherson case and he signed a confidential agreement with Scientology to keep the details of the settlement confidential among other things. Brian Haney settled his case with Digital Light Wave for north of $80 million dollars but he had to sign a confidential agreement not disclose the details of the settlement.

Brian Haney is a good man with deep religious convictions. Brian was also a financial supporter for the Lisa McPherson Trust; I think he may have given north of $100,000.00 to the Trust for support. He was the only person that had the guts to let me know how Bob and his new team planned to deal with me.

Patricia Greenway refused to cooperate with Scientology in any way and hired their own lawyers to fight them at their own expense. Patricia was always right there fighting back against the Scientology onslaught. You can see from the time track that she and her husband Peter produced the film “The Prophet”.

Bob had a healthy respect for Patricia Greenway and she was a confidant for him. Even after Bob decided to go with Scientology he would still talk with Patricia and she would try to get him away from the group he was with so that maybe he could get another perspective on his situation. Patricia reminded him that he could hire whatever out of state lawyers in would need to get out of his current mess. She didn’t agree that Bob had run out of options. Stacy hated the fact that Bob would consult with Patricia and she eventually convinced Bob to end his relationship with Patricia.

To add insult to injury, somehow Arnie Lerma has insisted on different news forums that Patricia Greenway is and “OSA” plant!  I mean, wasn’t it Arnie Lerma that went into settlement negotiations of legal cases on behalf of Scientology? Arnie was also fully aware of my situation and he also tried to get me to cooperate with Scientology to “help Bob”. I told him at the time where he could get off. We have since talked and he still tried to convince me that Bob and Stacy had did the right thing. I could only tolerate his betrayal and ignorance for so long. We’ve had some problems since.

Because I refused to cooperate with Scientology my punishment was “disconnection” and “fair game” as practiced in Scientology. With the exception of the Wollersheim case, Bob and Scientology made sure that I was not paid for any of the work I’d done in the cases they were able to settle. Even though I stood with Ken Dandar till the end on the Lisa McPherson case, I was not paid a dime for my work. It was the same in the Dennis Erlich case; I never even got a call thanking me for helping. The Scientology plan was to starve me and my family and cause us to lose everything we had. Their plans worked for the most part.

I spent months going thru the stress of foreclosure on my home in Florida. I also had the problem of reinventing a career to support my family which became an overnight priority. Because Lawrence Wollersheim refused to cooperate with Scientology I did receive a payment for my services in the case which sustained me while I searched for a new career.  I became a successful Mortgage Broker within 3 months and was able to maintain my financial obligations for awhile. Then the “fair gaming” got intense. Scientology relentlessly interfered with my employers and I found it nearly impossible to maintain continued employment in Florida. Scientology practically owns Clearwater, Florida where I lived so I was fighting a losing battle of slow death there. All too soon, I was facing the stress of foreclosure again. My friend, Brian Haney was not allowed to help me, but we worked something out anyway. Instead of losing my house in foreclosure I was able to sell it instead. Due to the extreme stress of the situation, my relationship with my partner failed as well. I ended up renting an apartment alone struggling to survive. I accepted the failure of my relationship with my partner on the basis of there was no way I could continue to walk down the dangerous path I’d chosen when she had a family in tow. I parted with her so that she could have peace and a chance at life detached from my madness. My partner had never been a Scientologist so it was all Greek to her but she hung in there as best she could given the circumstances. We have no malice between us to this day.

My partner was a woman of deep religious conviction and she was the Receptionist for the Lisa McPherson Trust. Anyone who knew her just loved her and her Spirit. She was extremely organized and was a great asset to the Trust.

Until recently, I’d only had one conversation that I remember with Stacy Brooks since she’d gone back under Scientology control. I talked to her when I found out her husband Vaughn Young died. When I learned Vaughn died something inside of me just broke. I remember the day I received the call informing me that Vaughn had passed. I had just parked in front of a house where I had an in home appointment with the homeowner to refinance their mortgage. My phone rang, and to this day I don’t remember who it was but they told me Vaughn had just passed. I sat in my car stunned. Time seemed suspended as I tried to rationalize how I could get out of this appointment and find the nearest bar. I just felt like I couldn’t make it thru a presentation in my current state. That feeling of deep down grief refused to be contained so I sat in my car and decided to cry just a little bit so I could get through the interview and meet my obligation to my employer. So I sat there and cried real hard like a big boy for a while, then I got out the vizen (sp?) and put it in my eyes, took a deep breath and went to the door and rang the doorbell of my potential clients.

I put on my happy face and introduced myself and handed the man my card. They welcomed me into their home and I started my presentation. Somehow that grief monster roared and I was crying like a baby again! My clients, a man and a woman looked at each other in horror, and then they looked at me with pity. I ended up explaining to them that a dear friend died and I was only informed as I pulled up to their home. They were very understanding and made me tea to calm down. When my grief had passed we continued the interview and I ended up getting the deal. At the end of my interview with my potential clients we all laughed about the issue that if I cried at all of my appointments I’d be a rich man! That couple was very understanding and showed me some love that I’ll never forget. I could have been fired from my job for my conduct if my employer only knew. After that appointment I returned to the home office of my employer and let them know that I’d be taking a few days off to grieve the loss of a friend and they allowed it.

When I got home that day I called Stacy and let her know I’d heard about Vaughn passing and my heart was totally broken. I don’t know why I called her. At the time I was under the full attack of Scientology’s fair game practice seemingly from all sides. I talked to her and cried, she talked to me and cried and said we really should talk. I told her I was not ready to have any dialogue with her, I just called because Vaughn was dead. Can’t say I remember how, but we ended our conversation and years would pass before we would talk again.

Vaughn Young and I traveled on what I consider to be an epic journey together through Scientology and we were always friends for different reasons.

Here is a link that provides a window into the life of the man known as Vaughn Young:


Here is a link that is a synopsis into the life of Vaughn Young, please make sure you read enough to get a sense of who Vaughn was:


Because I have to move this story along, I’m not going to get into all of the idiosyncrasies of the relationship Vaughn and I had together as freedom fighters right here, right now but I’ve missed him every day since he left us. Once Vaughn finally left Scientology, he never submitted to them again in any way for the rest of his life.

However I will take the time to say this. When Vaughn was first diagnosed with cancer he was informed the damage was irreversible. The cancer had metastasized into his bones and his days were numbered. Of course being an ex Scientologist he had no medical insurance policy to see him through any form of treatment. He also had no money to pay for treatment that could extend his life and let him accomplish finishing his work for others in the future.  I remember the phone call with Vaughn when he got the news. He was devastated and had no idea what to do. He and I discussed possible solutions when I remembered that Vaughn was a veteran of the US military! As a veteran he was eligible for free medical care for the rest of his life. I made him go to the Veterans Administration for medical care and they took him right in and started immediate treatment on him. Vaughn was able to live longer because of the treatment he was able to receive. He spent the rest of his life creating a blog about cancer survival and his work in Scientology. The work he was able to accomplish in his life in deed lives on.

Vaughn Young gave up the ghost on June 15, 2003, about one year after Bob Minton and Stacy Brooks decent into madness with Scientology. Even though Vaughn had his own personal suffering, he was a rock for me through these maddening times. He was the only person that never turned his back on me in any way as we fought for freedom without compromise as best we knew how.

When Vaughn passed, I felt truly alone in the struggle, so I simply began to disassociate myself from the subject of Scientology and just tried to live while years passed by. Who could have imagined what 7 short years could do!

Yes beloved, now we move forward to what has happened since the Hamburg conference!

Given my state of mind concerning Scientology, the Hamburg conference proved to be a coming out party for me! Everything about the conference was a miracle and wonder to my eyes and this is why I was so nervous. Could it be true? After nothing, I was suddenly in the presence of some old true friends, old friends and associates I’d known in Scientology. They were out and telling the truth about the Scientology experience. The biggest surprise for me was this new group of people who involved themselves in the struggle on the principle of opposing a discovered Tierney out of the goodness of their hearts! Intelligently, they call themselves Anonymous.

On the plane home, I struggled with wondering what I could write about that would be relevant and make a difference in the struggle as it presented itself in these present times.

My new dilemma was the realization that I had not been specific enough with what I’d asked and prayed for. I’d asked and prayed for Marty Rathbun to leave the Sea Org, but I didn’t bargain that he’d get out and start “auditing” people. I guess I just never considered the prospect of Marty leaving, effectively bringing Mike Rinder with him too, all auditing! Is there no mercy!

It sure could be worst that’s for sure and I’m laughing as I write this. I ended up having to defend these two fucks at the conference and plead for patience on their behalf. This came up when the subject of reform and Scientology were intermingled.

Here is a link to that segment of the Hamburg conference that my Anonymous brothers and sisters have provided:


I don’t remember if I’ve ever posted my speech at the Hamburg conference, but here is a link that can get you started:


When I got home I started to research Scientology on the internet to see if there was anything that I knew about on the subject that had not already be said in many different ways. In the sea of information available thru a Google search, it seemed any researcher could find everything they ever wanted to know about Scientology in spades.

My other dilemma was how could I teach Marty, and his bring along Mike that auditing in fact is not helpful for people who have decided to leave Scientology. In my opinion, Scientology had already robbed, raped and pillaged those it could get to follow their lies. Marty and Mike were just feeding on those who had the strength to leave on their own as they were leaving, so that point had continued to torture me.

As I pondered this dilemma my thoughts drifted back to auditing and my old skills on the subject. Only David Mayo, Hanna Eltringham, Glenn Samuels, Dennis Erlich, Ken Urquhart, myself and a few others have real historical credentials on the study of the Subject of Scientology and have left the movement. Some of them still practice Scientology. The answer as to what I could write about started to come to me. What the above people and myself had in common was we had all worked and communicated directly with L Ron Hubbard at some point in our Scientology sojourn and times of our mutual  experiences varied greatly. Few of us had worked together with L Ron at the same time. I realized what I had that was unique among my peers.  I’d been there with L Ron and for L Ron during the last four years of his life. L Ron did not live in the same place where I lived at Golden Era Production nor was he there all of the time. He was there some of the time and that’s what needed to be talked about. To date no one has written anything about this part of L Ron’s life and this became a valid subject for me to write about.

I guess I’d be justified in calling what I realized during my reflection and research as a cathartic experience because I realized something in my experience that I’d chalked up as insignificant. I realized this insignificant circumstance became the key to solving the auditing dilemma.

Specifically, earlier I’d said:

“My personal chosen path when I left was to leave the movement without any promise of payment from me to the Sea Org for anything past, present or future. I willingly and happily renounced any opportunity afforded me by my Sea Org handlers to continue my journey up their ladders or across any of their bridges.”

On the day I left Scientology, I left the subject with them. I had no use for or no desire to practice Scientology in any way. That condition didn’t begin there, it developed over time during the last four years of my service to L Ron Hubbard which also turned out to be the last four years of his life. What a coincidence!

Admittedly, I have not always been the sharpest knife in the drawer when it comes to common sense so I realized it was what I’d experienced during those last four years that convinced me, Scientology really was a dead end road. At the time I realized Scientology made perfect sense until the end. When is the end? The end comes when Scientology has taken all that it could from it’s victims with their consent. The minute the Scientology victim ceases to be useful or no longer agrees their end with the subject is near. Soon they realized most of the subject never made sense in the real world in the first place.

Seemingly to illustrate the point as I researched, old friends began calling me about a new article written by Lawrence Wright for the New Yorker magazine about Paul Haggis. This is a long ass article but well worth the read:


I had to stand up when I read the last paragraph of the article:

I once asked Haggis about the future of his relationship with Scientology. “These people have long memories,” he told me. “My bet is that, within two years, you’re going to read something about me in a scandal that looks like it has nothing to do with the church.” He thought for a moment, then said, “I was in a cult for thirty-four years. Everyone else could see it. I don’t know why I couldn’t.”

You see, even to smart people Scientology seemingly makes perfect sense until the very end. Butter knife or dagger, it makes no difference.

Well, being in the butter knife category I knew I had my reasons for never again permitting myself to be subjected to any further Scientology treatment or training in any way. I thought as a common man, if I can come to this conclusion anyone can so I set about the task of writing about the last 4 years of L Ron Hubbard’s life and my experience with such, happy to have a direction to write towards.

I diligently set upon the task of writing about the last four years of L Ron’s life in an effort to present to people the evidence it had and then let them decided if more or any Scientology was necessary, but all of this “explaining things” flew out of my fingers first!

When I decided to continue to publish my story, I had no preconceived ideas of what I would discover. For me it was all just a matter of putting it all together and connecting the dots. That was working fine for me as I went along with my research until the day I felt compelled to stop researching and start writing.

Remember when I stared this I wrote:

I guess ignorance really is a bliss compared to how I feel now after discovering what I can only describe as unnerving and horrifying information that is very personal to me.

I do apologize for the long preamble but it was necessary to make the right connections with the story I’ve been trying to tell. As a working title, I’m calling this next part Book II. This is the end of Book I.



Book one

Epilogue



Wow! Getting thru this much is a milestone for me. I can honestly say I have never written this much about anything in my life. It sure wasn’t easy at all. I want to thank everyone who has taken the time to read the information on this blog. Please don’t worry about the information being too exclusive to have broad appeal. That’s not the case. Since I’ve started posting this story just over a month ago on this blog, I want to show you some statistics of how many people are reading this from around the world:

When I first started posting these chapters on March 11, 2011 until the end of the month of March, I received 5,092 page views. As of this date, April 22, 2011 there has been a total of 6,667 page views. This number grows at a rate of 100 plus a day some days. Yesterday there were a total of 125 page views.

March 11, 2011 is the day I released the first chapter “Back in the Saddle again.” On that day alone there were 540 page views. On March 27, 2011 I published chapters titled “Part 4”. On that day there were 940 page views.

Here is a list of some of the people and countries who have viewed this blog:

United States
4,509
United Kingdom
488
Canada
473
Germany
240
Australia
149
Sweden
82
Netherlands
53
Norway
45
France
44
Finland
37



There is also a smaller audience in countries like Iran, Mexico, China, Brazil, Costa Rica, Italy and South Africa.

People viewing this Blog are using all kinds of operating systems:

Pageviews by Operating Systems
Windows
4,877 (73%)
Macintosh
1,203 (18%)
Other Unix
173 (2%)
iPhone
170 (2%)
iPad
85 (1%)
Linux
76 (1%)
PLAYSTATION 3
16 (<1%)
BlackBerry
12 (<1%)
Windows NT 6.1
12 (<1%)
Nokia
6 (<1%)



So there is interest being generated here on a daily basis since the inception of the work.

I realize it has taken me longer to get this part done than I would have liked but I’m glad it’s behind me now. I have strived to write this from the perspective of providing information that could be useful to those considering a career in Scientology or for those who may know others who are in Scientology and simply want to understand something about the subject.

 One thing that I’m willing to say about the human experience so far is in all fairness, no one is perfect and we all make mistakes. However the test is this, after making a mistake or error are you willing to admit to it and make things right? When you know the lie is a myth but the truth hurts what do you do? Is there no absolute standard answer for every given situation there is?Yet that is the Scientology way. Scientology would have you believe there is one answer to everyone’s issues in life. How they make people believe that is something I will cover in Book 2. 

In telling my story I’ve had to include information about other people. What I’ve had to say about these people can certainly be taken as an admonishment of them. I’ve taken every effort I know to not ride the “Righteous indignation horse” here but a few people  would say I’d earned a place in that saddle.

Marty Rathbun, Stacy Brooks and Mike Rinder certainly may feel like I bruised some feelings but that is just collateral damage for getting out the truth as I know it. There is no one else who is willing or able to talk about these issues so I do.

It’s a common tactic for an invading force to “Divide and Conquer” an opponent. This is an intelligence tactic for sure and not exclusive to Scientology intelligence operatives. I have to say that Scientology practices the principle of “Divide and Conquer” as well as any other invader. I don’t want to fight or argue with Marty and Mike about doing auditing at this time. I realize there is nothing that I can say to change them right now. What I can do is show them and any other Scientologist what I discovered about the origins of Scientology. If a person still wants to associate with the subject after that, than that’s on them.

I have refused to be the person that keeps Scientology’s secrets or tolerate their behavior no matter what. This was not an easy thing to do given how long I was in there but I did it anyway. I’m not the only one, others have as well. My point is freedom ain’t free. When a person doesn’t fight for their own personal freedom, that freedom can be lost or taken away. Yes, right here in the good old USA, Scientology is on a mission to create a slave society using tax payer dollars to do it.

After about 7 or 8 years had passed, Stacy sent a message to a mutual associate of ours and asked him to find out if I’d be willing to talk with her again. I told him I’d talk and gave him my phone number to give to Stacy. She called and we talked for a long time. She told me that Bob wanted to talk to me and we planned for a phone conversation soon. Within two weeks of that phone call, Stacy called me and let me know that Bob had passed away. She explained to me how he passed and the circumstances with how he passed and all of the funeral arrangements. I really didn’t know what to think or say, I just felt numb.

Bob Minton was a very special person. By no means was he a Saint. Bob had amassed a tremendous amount of money during his life. It seems to me that when Bob found out about the Scientology issue he began to pour the money he’d made into trying to make things right for people who had been victimized and shuttered into silence by Scientology. Bob freely gave to all that asked. This may have been his undoing because despite the fact that he would give out huge sums of money there were those that still just hated him. Some people hated him because he had money. Some people hated Bob because he was not spending his money the way they thought he should be. Some people hated him because of his affair with Stacy Brooks. Like I said, Bob was no Saint.

Bob was more of a benign Angel in my opinion. I’ll always remember him for what he did do to help others. In a way, Bob became a Martyr at the hands of Scientology.  The two timelines above illiterate how Bob was killed in Spirit He sure didn’t live long after all of that happened.

I am truly very thankful to Ursula Caberta for inviting me to the Hamburg Conference. I think I had given up on the issue of trusting other people. To see all of the new people picking up the ball with continuing to picket and expose Scientology was more that I could have ever hoped for. The group that call themselves Anonymous came together on their own to fight Scientology. I don’t think they had any in-depth knowledge of the inner workings of Scientology. Based on the bully aspect alone, Anonymous stood up to Scientology and have been fighting every since. For that reason I dedicate this first book to the people who call themselves Anonymous and I thank them for their help.



Moving forward



When I decided to write “my story” I wanted to publish it in a book format but without the book. I also wanted to make the information free to anyone who wanted to read about it. Publishing in this format has its advantages because I am able to link to other websites and provide as much evidence as I can. To date, this has been a solo effort all the way and I could use some help with this now. In my experience, the most effective way to combat Scientology’s Tyranny is to broadly expose it. Here is my plan to get the message out there:

1.     Now that I have a rough draft for the first book I need to go back and edit and format the work. Maybe it’s easier to read in sections like I have it, I’m not sure but it does need major editing. I also invite anyone to write to me if they think I need to clarify a point or add information to it and I’ll tell you how to do that in just a minute. I need some editing help here!



2.     Once the editing and formatting is complete I’d also like to get the work translated into at least 2 other languages, German and French. Because many people don’t use the computer to read books, I still think it will be worth publishing in paperback form and still be free on the internet. I need some help with presenting what I have to a Publisher. If there is anyone out there that knows of a Publisher that may be interested in this work I ask for your help with getting this work to them for review. I will tell you how to contact me about that in just a minute.



3.     I’d like to create a website to host the information I’m writing about here and any other information vital to the subject. I want to do that so that I can host videos as well. So far this is a reading experience only, which is fine but I want to get some visuals going here to. I could use some help with that.



4.     So far, this has been a solo effort in every way. I have gone through 2 hard drives while getting this information out. I have had some wicked viruses sent to me that wiped out the hard drives. In order for me to properly document the information in my next book I need to purchase some materials. My intention is to make the information free to all that will read it but in reality nothing is free. If any of the information I have provided to you so far was useful or helpful I ask that you make a small contribution to the cause and I’ll tell you how to do that in just a minute.



Due to the nature of the subject, I am not using my blog site to blog on at this time. I can’t divulge all of my plans publicly yet. If anyone is able to help me financially all I ask is that you contribute $20.00, (the average price for a new book) and send it to me in a letter thru the mail. I have worked at the Post Office here in Chicago on a seasonal basis for the last two years and I know this is a safe and secure line to use.  If anyone is able to help in the above 4 areas I ask that you send your help and suggestions to the following mailing address, which is where I live:



Jesse Prince

521 West 61st Street

Chicago, IL 60621

If you are able to send money send a single cash bill if you can. If you want to contribute with a check that’s fine as well. I want to do it this way to ensure the privacy of those who may send something. I give my word to anyone that sends me mail that their identity will be held in confidence if you prefer that. I will also destroy all records of anyone who sends mail to me if you prefer that.

I know I need to invest in some “Dragon Software” programs to get the information that I have out faster and I will. I thank you all in advance and you will be hearing from me again soon!









































                                                                                                         






























63 comments:

  1. Bravo Jesse, Bravo. That was one helluva a finale for your book on explaining things!!!

    Cant wait to hear more about Book Two. Finding out something in regards to the last 4 years of LRH's life is very intriguing.

    ReplyDelete
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  2. Thanks for writing Jesse. We Anonymous mostly know you from your time in the LMT, and the Jesse Prince Affidavit especially. I knew Stacy Brooks didn't exactly have a sterling reputation, but always figured it was due to the affair. RVY is also known to us through his writings, and he was definitely not a butter knife.

    Know this though: While most of us have never been in Scientology, we despise it every bit as much as you do, if not more.

    Your work in the LMT definitely helped lay the groundwork for this, and your perspective re: Bob Minton could prove an interesting one. I do have one specific question for you.

    What did Minton say about Anonymous? Bunker never gave us any details, though I'm sure he has them.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Wow. Jesse. I have watched and read about you on the internet now for several years and have wondered about you and the gang of the LMT. Thank you so much for writing this. One question--you don't say much about Mark Bunker or Tory Christman. Are they just unwitting innocents in the whole horrible saga, or what?

    ReplyDelete
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  4. Jesse, I hope that you are at some level aware that here on the internet in particular you have a much broader audience than even your site stats can record. Your words and your example have reached many, many thousands of people, active Scientologists, exes and non-participants alike. Thank you for transforming some frankly horrific experiences and discoveries into this knowledge that can be of help to so many. Best wishes to you in your continuing efforts.

    ReplyDelete
  5. (raises hand) Jesse please lurk here when you have a chance:

    http://forums.whyweprotest.net/threads/jesse-princes-finale-about-the-lisa-mcpherson-trust.79729/page-2#post-1493870

    ReplyDelete
  6. Hey Jesse! I just wanted to let you know how fabulous it is that you're finally getting your story out.

    After years and years of having people post their emotional attempts at re-writing history, it sure feels good to see the facts come out--without all the agendas and bias.

    BRAVO, kiddo! If anybody can get the whole story out just as it happened it's you and I, for one, want to thank you. In fact, this is the first time I've posted to the internet since May 2001! So you know damned well your writing caught my attention LOL.(In fact I just hope to hell I can figure out how to post on this blog!)

    As an aside and from your blog: Jesse, regarding Patrick Jost--didn't he go to jail? I'm fairly certain he did so if I'm mistaken, please let me know.

    That was always a shocker for me that Bob eventually decided to hire Patrick Jost because the first time I ever heard his name was when Bob described him as an "f'ing scam artist."

    I'll never forget it---it was just about the time the LMT opened and we were having dinner with Bob and he said: "Oh Patricia, you're gonna love this: Some clown called me up promising me he had the "magic bullet" to bring down Scientology."

    I said: yeahsurefine...and what does he want for this magic bullet?

    Bob said: " He wants me to give him $100,000 UP FRONT and he claims he has everything I need to shut down the whole cult"

    "And your response to him was...?"

    "Patricia, the stupid SOB must think I'm an idiot! F no! He's just an F'ing scam artist"

    And, Jesse, based on that I always thought that was the end of Patrick Jost---until I got to Leipzig in 2001 and there he was!

    I asked Bob about it and he said that Jost had reappeared offering his help to fend off the attacks that were surrounding his banks overseas and that since he'd worked for the Treasury (I believe it was) that he had special knowledge that would be of assistance.

    But you know me---I was still hung up on the "magic bullet" incident and I just couldn't get my head around this person being of any assistance to anybody.

    As it turned out, he really didn't help at all--so it was no surprise to me to hear he'd landed in prison.

    Anyway,Jesse, I just wanted to ask you to verify that so I can keep MY facts straight as well.

    Again, thank you for stepping up old friend--I look forward to reading more of your story.

    Best regards,
    Patricia Greenway

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  7. Thank you for speaking out, Jesse.

    Your story made many things about this affair much clearer. So sad. All those basically good people whose lives and reputations were destroyed by an evil and totally ruthless criminal organization.

    Thanks again, with my sincerest regards,

    N.N.

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  8. Yah, thanks Jess. Patricia has been bad-mouthed by Worma and his ilk for long enuf! You set the record straight.

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  10. Thanks for posting this Jesse, very interesting. Being on the outside of all the things that went on with LMT and Bob it was difficult and at times heartbreaking to follow - even if I was far away. I appreciate some of the pieces falling in place.

    All the best,
    Andreas
    www.xenu.net

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  11. Hi Jessie,

    Thanks for your honesty and clarity in your comments. Sure is nice to see you here, I always had great respect for your work in the anti-cult field. No hysteria in your blog.

    Nice to see TFCVP here commenting. :) Visit us on IRC Patricia soon. :-)

    justWog

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  12. Dear Jesse:

    I’m writing to ask you to rethink what you’re saying about the people who settled with Scientology. I’m, of course, one of those people, and I know a number of other people in that group very personally. I consequently know quite a bit about that group’s experience, and am able to discuss and defend them or us.
    Some months ago, a longtime friend told me that you were talking smack about me, and the reason you gave for bad-mouthing me was that I had taken Scientology’s money in settlement. I’m hoping to get you to change this computation.

    Rest of letter here: http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/archives/4847

    Gerry

    ReplyDelete
  13. Hi Dennis---Hi JustWog! LTNS!
    Sorry I haven't been around, but the ANONYs have been doing such a great job of handling the cult, I'm guilty of staying off the net for the most part.

    Also, I just got so bored with all the same crap from the Minton revisionists---the same gaping maws....yawn.

    Those of us that were there and still sane know what happened and why and no amount of revisionism is going to change the facts.

    God love Jesse for having the patience and fortitude to step up and set the record straight. I guess it's long overdue.

    I was especially happy to see Jesse bring up RVY..as I was lucky enough to spend time with him before he passed.

    I guess this as good a place as any to share my story about that time:

    Back during the time of the Dandar Disqualification Hearings, as you know, I stepped up (because nobody else would) as a volunteer trial consultant on the cult. It wasn't anything I dreamed of doing since I had a full time job and this DEFINITELY took up all my time. But Ken got blindsided fast and hard as the cult had compromised Bob..as well as two of Ken's professional trial consultants (Garko and Haverty)---yes, it was a rapid broad stroke that left Ken, who was mid-trial on another case, left to quickly find representation for himself this time as the judge ordered the proceedings to commence immediately. I got hold of Luke---introduced him to Ken and thus started WEEKS of court time for the 3 of us.

    Seeing Bob turn against Ken and everybody else he'd been friends with was shocking...especially for me, who, contrary to popular belief (and the shore stories of the Minton sychophants), Bob and I had stayed friends right up until he turned.

    He kept it a secret from everyone--including Stacy. He used to call me late at night when Stacy had gone to bed..or he would sneak out to his barn to call me so she wouldn't know. Yes, this is fact...also true: I had for a long time been suspicious of Stacy and everybody who knew me at the time knows this. So I kept the communication lines open in case he needed a friend.

    During those days when Bob was forced to lie in court in order to satisfy the cult's demands that he discredit everybody, Bob used to sneak out of the court room on ciggie breaks to talk to me. Of course I couldn't wrap my head around this total flip flop and I wasted a significant amount of hours trying to make him wake up---to no avail. Eventually Stacy caught us talking and asked the judge to keep me away from Bob.

    Note: this is running long so I'll split this in half with a follow up to finish

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  14. As I said, I'll never forget the utter shock and sadness we all felt watching Bob lie his ass off in court. Jesse and I both succumbed to the emotions of seeing this from our friend and we eventually left the court room in tears.

    What wasn't surprising was watching Stacy on the stand in court spin the whole thing---she was good at that. After all, she was a PR flack for the cult (she also wrote for that propaganda rag FREEDOM Mag).

    She insisted that all her previous (and extremely damaging) affidavits from previous years were fiction---lies for money, as she told the judge. She recanted all her previous statements about the cult and it was no surprise to see her cozy up to Moxon during breaks.

    But what really set me off was when she claimed that not only HER affidavits and declarations were lies, but those of RVY. She claimed that she and RVY were paid by anti-cult lawyers to lie and they did it for the money. It sickened me---when we all knew RVY was dying of cancer--to have all his years of work discredited like that.

    During the next break I asked Ken if we shouldn't inform RVY of what was happening--so Ken called him. RVY was sick as a dog from his cancer at that point, but he was so livid that all his years of work was being discredited in sworn testimony, he insisted on flying down to Florida to correct the record.

    At that point the Judge would not allow any upcoming witnesses to be in the court room until they had testified so I offered to keep RVY company until it was his time on the stand.

    We went across the street from the St Pete Court house to this little restaurant and had lunch and talked. At that point I didn't know him well, but I told him that HE was the first person I contacted when I was looking for info on the net to help me get Peter out of the cult.

    I asked him if he remembered my email asking him to call me. He looked at me suspiciously and said NO, you didn't send me an email. I said, yes, it was on this date and that year and I got a little nervous when an at-that- point unknown person named Stacy Brooks called me asking me what I wanted.

    He said: IMPOSSIBLE---I remember every person who contacted me and I did NOT get your email. I said: Oh yes you did, because Stacy was the one to call me. He looked very upset and quietly said: "Stacy and I were NOT together at that time--so that means she had the password to my email account...which explains how she presented (in court) an email from me that I had not given to her."

    My mouth dropped (as I've been known to do) and finally found the words to ask him: "So what do you think of Stacy turning like this---and now realizing she was accessing your email?"

    He got very quiet and said: It's all business, Patricia.

    I was like: Huh??

    He said: Stacy does what she's trained to do--no hard feelings--it's all business.

    He was very quiet for a long time and appeared to be sad so I didn't belabor the issue.

    The call to get him on the witness stand came shortly thereafter and he did a masterful job of defending both his actions and his work. Such a strong resiliant man...to suffer this type of betrayal yet bore no harsh feelings..he was pretty amazing.

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  15. @Gerry Armstrong: I just reviewed all all of the few posts here on Jesse's blog and I see no such "smack talk" about you or any of the others who ended up settling with Co$.

    You might consider paying less attention to what you are told by others and instead, using your God-given eyes to read what actually is and has been written by Jesse, which you clearly have not.

    Michael A. Hobson
    TheSneakster on Ex-Scn Message Board

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  16. @The Sneakster: "using your God-given eyes to read what actually is and has been written by Jesse, which you clearly have not."

    Err.. ^^^ funny that. How about this passage:

    "Anyone else that I know of has sold a piece of their soul for Scientology’s money by promising to keep quiet. Accepting Scientology’s money in this way in the end proves to be a sellout. ... It’s a selfish decision to know of something that actively hunts and preys on good people just like you and not warn them for money, not to mention the lifetime Scientology tether agreement is always around your neck."

    Personally I don't judge people who settled, given what the Church of Scientology put them through. The part which I have a hard time is the lying or unduly acting or pressuring on behalf of the Church of Scientology to help its other cases "go away" as part of a settlement.

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  17. @R-Hill: passage you cited does not meet the requirements for "smack talk" ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smack_talk ) although it certainly qualifies as "chastisement".

    Whether that chastisement is just or not in Gerry Armstrong's case, I know not.

    Michael A. Hobson
    TheSneakster on Ex-Scn Message Board

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  18. R. Hill, your point is well taken. I never judged anybody who settled with a gag. I've had the pleasure of meeting many of those folks who were forced into a settlement and quite honestly, many of them had done all they could and they just couldn't withstand any more.

    When the cult targets you for destruction, they orchestrate your isolation as well. Using surrogates who, either knowingly or not, set out to cause riffs and divisions within your support system and after extensive programs to wear you down, the cult has a way of jumping up and down on your last nerve.

    It's hard to judge someone who has reached their limit and just wants it all to go away. Often, the person being targeted never sees any light at the end of the tunnel and they fold like a deck chair when ANY option is offered to them that will end the attack.

    Granted, the critics at large would prefer that this person resist the temptation and continue "fighting the good fight"---but I've seen too many people perilously close to breaking who truly need to stop.

    This is exactly why I continued my friendship with Bob Minton when he announced he was "walking away." In fact, I was having dinner with Ken Dandar when the infamous call came in from Bob.

    Ken's cell phone rang and I heard this:
    "What? What? What are you saying, Bob? You KNOW I can't do that."

    He covered the phone with his hand and said to me: "I think Bob's been drinking or something--he's demanding I drop the Lisa case"

    He listened to Bob for a few more minutes and then hung up.

    He said: "Bob says the blood of his children and his wife will be on MY hands if I don't drop the case"

    We were stunned and, knowing Bob the way I did, I said: "Oh DEFINITELY, he's been drinking..or he's off his meds (Bob was bi-polar). Just ignore it Ken, he'll have his act together tomorrow--he's just been under a lot of stress lately."

    But that wasn't to be.

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  19. (continued from previous comment because I exceeded the limit:-)

    I knew Ken was too dedicated to Lisa's family to drop the case for ANYBODY, so I wasn't worried about that happening, but I realized soon thereafter that Bob had reached the end of his tether.

    I had great empathy for his "emotional collapse" and I was still concerned for his well-being even though I was appalled at the thought of his going into "negotiations" with the cult without his attorney present.

    Where we finally parted company was when he started throwing EVERYBODY under the bus. The very last conversation I had with Bob dealt with that specifically. I sat there begging him to reconsider his decision in that regard. I told him: NOBODY is going to blame you for walking away---a person can only do what he can do--but setting out to destroy the reputations, lives and livelihood of people is beyond the pale. WALK AWAY but do NOT take all these people down!

    But somehow, someone convinced Bob that this was all necessary for "the deal." Bob had been sold a bill of goods that just walking away was not good enough and he set out on this path of destruction scripted by the cult.

    The "shock and awe" we experienced as we watched Bob in court was stunning for all of us that had come to care about Bob. No words can describe the feeling of total sadness, disgust and at times acrimony as he sat in that court room lying under oath in order to satisfy the cult.

    And I guess that's where quite a few of us drew the line of distinction between "walking away" and becoming a weapon for the cult.

    In the end, Bob got no real settlement--it was HE that paid them. He handed them the keys to the LMT building (chock full of archival documents donated by countless exers)and paid them off. He discredited only himself on the witness stand and I'm sure, knowing Bob, this sickened even him.

    We who had known him all asked ourselves: How can he live with himself after that?

    Such a tragedy. And when given the choice: walk away with a gag, he most likely would be here today if he'd done so.

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  20. @ Mike A. Hobson
    May 2, 2011 11:57 PM

    Well, of course, clearly I haven’t read what actually is and has been written by Jesse. Someone would have to be a pretty big blowhard to even suggest he had.

    Rest at gerryarmstrong.org...

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  21. Dear Jesse:

    You write:

    "What the above people and myself had in common was we had all worked and communicated directly with L Ron Hubbard at some point in our Scientology sojourn and times of our mutual experiences varied greatly. Few of us had worked together with L Ron at the same time. I realized what I had that was unique among my peers. I’d been there with L Ron and for L Ron during the last four years of his life. L Ron did not live in the same place where I lived at Golden Era Production nor was he there all of the time. He was there some of the time and that’s what needed to be talked about. To date no one has written anything about this part of L Ron’s life and this became a valid subject for me to write about." http://princejesse53.blogspot.com/2011/04/finale-here-it-is-for-you-now.html

    I last saw Hubbard at Gilman in 1979. I was based in LA from early 1980 through 1981, but came to Gilman a number of times throughout that period, and had never heard of Hubbard being there after 1979.

    I have never before heard that in the period from the fall of 1982 when you arrived at Gilman through January 1986 when Hubbard died he had been there some of the time.

    I think Marty has said that he never met Hubbard, and it seems odd that you would have been working with Hubbard at Gilman when Marty had not.

    So you know, there are people who have written about that part of Hubbard’s life actually. Steve Pfauth, who was with Hubbard in Creston, comes to mind. He’s never mentioned, that I know of, Hubbard coming back to Gilman during the year you were there.

    I agree that the time Hubbard was at Gilman is worth writing about, so I hope you’ll post about your interactions with him at Gilman.

    You write in your August 20, 1999 affidavit for the Estate of Lisa McPherson v. Scientology case:

    "5. In the position of “Deputy Inspector General, External”, I was in charge of supervising all activities in every aspect of Scientology, i.e., supervising senior management structure of the “mother church”, Church of Scientology International, CSI. In the hierarchy of all of Scientology, I was only two steps removed from L. Ron Hubbard. Mr. Hubbard gave his orders to David Miscavige who in turn gave them to me to supervise, delegate and enforce their execution." http://www.xenu-directory.net/documents/prince19990820.html

    This was the idea I’d gathered from that affidavit and your early similar statements.

    I’m looking forward to reading your details about Hubbard at Gilman.

    ReplyDelete
  22. @Gerry: I read the contract, and at first I thought it must have to do with protecting a then ongoing lawsuit. But there are disturbing terms in there, like "shall remain confidential forever." Forever?

    I also find troubling that the expert would have to agree beforehand that a breach "will cause irreparable damage" and yet further state that "damages may be difficult to ascertain."

    The most troubling part though is that "injunctive relief" may be entered against the expert's "employees, family members and/or business" along with a minimum of $2.5M fine... WTF!?

    I can see why would anyone balk at signing this, Caroline sure did the right thing.

    This boggles me. Is this standard contract for expert witnesses?

    ReplyDelete
  23. @R. Hill

    I have testified as an expert witness in several Scientology-related lawsuits, and I never was requested to sign such a document.

    Before Caroline flew to Florida, when Ken Dandar spoke with her about her future freedom to communicate if hired as an expert, he told her that she would be free to talk to me. When she arrived in his office, however, with Ms. Greenway, Lirot and Dandar there, she was told that the “agreement” would apply to talking to me. This was unacceptable for obvious reasons. She would not be able to tell me even if the people on the McPherson side lied to her or abused her in any way, which, it had already been observed, could happen. The “agreement” and its interpretation would create a situation between Caroline and me that Scientology would love and exploit.

    See these a.r.s. threads from that period:
    Here and here.

    There is a bunch more attacks from that period by people ostensibly on the McPherson side.

    When all this happened, we thought that this “agreement” sounded like it was related to protecting movie rights – The Lisa McPherson Story, not The Profit – and not protecting the interests of the Lisa McPherson Estate.

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  24. Thank you, Jesse, for coming forward after so long and telling the truth. I'm disappointed by the people who would rather perpetuate lies, but they don't discredit you in the least.

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  25. Jesse's explanation of how Scientology corrupts law enforcement on video at the Riverside Board of Supervisors:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03VMfjJoP90

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  26. "Because I refused to cooperate with Scientology my punishment was “disconnection” and “fair game” as practiced in Scientology. With the exception of the Wollersheim case, Bob and Scientology made sure that I was not paid for any of the work I’d done in the cases they were able to settle. Even though I stood with Ken Dandar till the end on the Lisa McPherson case, I was not paid a dime for my work. It was the same in the Dennis Erlich case; I never even got a call thanking me for helping. The Scientology plan was to starve me and my family and cause us to lose everything we had. Their plans worked for the most part."

    Dear Jesse:

    I’m hoping you’ll provide some details about the matters you’ve raised here.

    What cases were Bob and Scientology able to settle?

    They didn’t settle McPherson, Wollersheim, or Erlich. They did settle Armstrong VII, but you could not have worked on that case surely. I asked you for help in that case, but, as I mentioned, you wouldn’t. Bob and the LMT settled out of that case in, I believe, 2003, and I have no details about what the conditions of the settlement were. http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50grand/writings/ars/ars-2003-07-24.html

    I have no doubt that Bob was pressured mightily by a number of people to turn on me, but I have seen no evidence that that happened. It’s possible the Scientologists have a stack of documents they got Bob to sign that they’re waiting to dump on me and the world when it suits them, but so far I have to be grateful to Bob for not totally giving in as the people who hate us wanted.

    Scientology didn’t file Armstrong VII until April 2, 2002, which was after Bob and Stacy were, essentially, not working with you on Scientology cases.

    The Haney case was also not settled by Bob and Scientology. So I’m wondering what were the cases they were able to settle that you worked on?

    It seems to me that Bob couldn’t be responsible for you not being paid in the McPherson case, and actually Scientology couldn’t either. This settlement, of course, was in 2004, two years after Bob’s withdrawal from any involvement in the case. The people responsible for paying you or not would be the Estate representative and attorneys for the Estate at the time of the settlement. According to this SP Times article, “it was Lirot, Dandar and his brother, and McPherson’s aunt, Dell Liebreich.” http://www.sptimes.com/2004/05/29/Tampabay/Scientologists_settle.shtml

    Regarding Dennis not calling you and thanking you for helping in his case, the same happened with me. But he settled with Scientology in 1999, three years before Bob’s agreements with Scientology. I think I recall too that Bob was not happy with Dennis settling as he did, and not acknowledging people like yourself, because Dennis had apparently stated that he would never be silenced or some such thing, and then became silent. But I can’t see how Bob made sure you weren’t paid in the Erlich case.

    If Dennis, Dandar, Dandar, Dell, Lirot and Haney didn’t pay you for work they should have paid you for, they certainly helped Scientology, which I have no doubt would have loved to see you ruined and starving. I just don’t think it’s right to view Bob as responsible for these people not paying you in cases in which he had zero control.

    ReplyDelete
  27. @Jerry Armstrong: Dear Jerry, just so you know I don't argue or debate with anyone on news groups or blogs. You seem to have many questions and you seem to have many contridictions to "My Story". I have two suggestions for you.

    1. Please take the time to read what I have written. I think if you do, many of your questions will be answered.

    2. Write your own book or start your own blog. You don't need to ride my coat tail to suddenly bring up all of these counter points.

    Well okay it's three.

    3. Keep reading, it can only help.

    Thank you, Jesse Prince

    ReplyDelete
  28. Jesse, whatever you do, don't stop talking.

    As I've always told you: your story is too important to sit on.

    Many people have no clue what you went through to get to this point, so maybe I can give a little insight here.

    Back when Bob first started trying to put the LMT together, he told me that the one person he couldn't do without was JESSE PRINCE. He told me that he was "working you over" to get you down to Florida and he asked me, since I had years of experience in Real Estate and had already found homes for Stacy and Bunker,to stand by ready to find you a home in Clearwater.

    I'll never forget talking to you about the prospect of your moving down. You hated the idea. You had spent so much time trying to forget the whole SCN experience you couldn't imagine descending back in to the hell of Scientology's mecca.

    You had a wonderful girlfriend, Dee, and her kids who you loved like your own. You had family around you and basically you were stabilizing your life. The thought of ripping that apart to uproot to Clearwater was NOT your idea of a smart move---and you made that clear to everybody! LOL

    But who could resist Bob? He promised you the moon if you'd make the move. And with time you two had become the original "asshole buddies"--the love between you two was so apparent to anybody who saw you two together. So,with a whole lot of verbal persuasion and incessant nagging, eventually you caved in and there you were---back in the belly of the beast.

    At first it was a busy time--trying to find someone brave enough to rent us a spot for the LMT. God knows how many PI's we had following us around when we looked for office space.

    Every time we found an office space that would work, we'd get a call back from the agent saying they'd changed their mind. Eventually Bob was forced to BUY a building and it was, in my mind, more than unfortunate that it was practically attached to the OSA Bank building.

    But we got it open and had our celebration---any attempt to buck us all up for the task at hand. I think you'll enjoy this video:

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3509970396523772585#

    Watching that brought tears to my eyes, Jesse--I'll bet you have the same response.

    I'm sure with time you'll write the story about all the work you put in to the LMT---all the trials and tribulations.

    As you recall I had problems with the way the LMT was being run and per usual I voiced my objections which led to Peter and I leaving the board. But you hung in there--giving it your all. And, I'm sure you'll eventually talk about how everything started going haywire there which led to when Stacy decided to close the LMT.

    Teresa Summers, who did such great work at the LMT counseling exers, wrote this about that time:
    http://www.xenu-directory.net/mirrors/www.whyaretheydead.net/lisa_mcpherson/bob/exhibits/p15b.html

    and this:
    http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.scientology/browse_thread/thread/b680f9cd5d452e4f/a9dd8fca2a55aaae?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=%22teresa+summers%22,+Stacy&pli=1

    And I point to these as examples of how everything just blew up, so it sure would behoove you to flesh out the rest of the story of that period of time.

    Needless to say, all hell broke loose and I know that as you saw it all coming apart at the seams you felt your life there was becoming uncertain as well. And hopefully you'll write about that too.

    I think I'm about to exceed the word limit for comments so I'll continue in the next...

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  29. (continued)

    As you recall, Jesse, that was about the time that Bob was sort of hiding out in New Hampshire to avoid some court hearing. Stacy was with him. Everybody started scattering and there you were wondering how the hell you were going to keep afloat---what with a mortgage to pay and a family to support. After all, you drug them down here and now everybody just bailed.

    I've talked more than enough about how stunning Bob's eventual flip flop was for the rest of us--but for YOU---Jesus, I can't even imagine.

    I remember the day Ken, Luke and I were brainstorming to prep for Ken's Disqual hearings and I was the one who suggested Ken get hold of you. I knew in my heart of hearts that you would NOT follow Bob and Stacy down the cult's rabbit hole. When we couldn't reach you, I called on Frank Oliver to help find you..which, thank God, he did.

    Your willingness to step up and help Ken rather than follow Bob, your pal, was heart-wrenching. After all that you were experiencing...and what you were about to face regarding your own livelihood, you stepped up and, as a result, I learned more about your character than I ever had before!

    Much has already been written about those long weeks in court for Ken's Disqual hearing, but what happened afterward is what I'd like to talk about.

    Left with trying to pay a mortgage and support your family, you were left in a real quandary. I couldn't help but think: Jaysus! He uprooted himself to come down here and everybody's GONE! He's stuck here with no job, betrayed by friends closest to him, with a family to support in a place he despised! You couldn't just RUN---after all, Dee was in school for optometry, the kids were in the middle of their school year...what a MESS!

    I reached out to you Jesse because I just couldn't imagine being in your shoes. I'm sure you remember our many talks---I was the one who suggested you forget the whole Scientology game and concentrate on getting yourself out of the mess you were left with.

    Granted, a lot of people on the net were urging you to come out and talk about what went down, but they weren't paying your bills. So blame me, Jesse, I just wanted you to survive and, with the cult still tracking you and attempting to destroy you for not "taking their deal", I felt that SCN was not a subject you should be concerning yourself with---SURVIVAL and SANITY was the path and I urged you at every turn to focus on those two things and nothing else.

    I know you had rough patches--what, with the cult contacting every employer who hired you, and you lost Dee (but not her friendship) yet you perservered and eventually got out of Clearwater and back into the bosom of friends and family up in Chicago.

    I always knew that once you felt safe and STABLE again, your need to help the victims of the cult would overtake you :-) That's why I asked Ursula to invite you to Hamburg---I knew it was time!

    So now that you're back to telling your story and helping those who were sucked in to the cult, don't be derailed by the "gaping maws"...PLEASE.

    You've got one hell of a story to tell and as long you can keep your wits about you and stay safe, there's a lot of people cheering you on.

    GO FOR IT!

    ReplyDelete
  30. @tfcvp: "You've got one hell of a story to tell and as long you can keep your wits about you and stay safe, there's a lot of people cheering you on."

    I like when people share their accounts re. Scientology. But seeing that people who asks questions on his completely public account are put down doesn't make me cheer, quite the contrary.

    Gerry raised a good point: Did Jesse sign that non-disclosure agreement that Caroline was asked to sign? If so, that's kind of important, because that would mean as a reader, I would have to keep in mind that his account might have required the "expressed written consent of the [Estate] and Kennan G. Dandar."

    By respect to the readers it should be disclosed whether his account had to go through an "authorization" step first, as the contract requires. Or maybe he didn't sign it, and thus he should just say so, clearing the doubt in the readers mind that the account is "filtered" or not.

    I've realized lately that another disclosure which is quite often missing from these various accounts re. the LMT etc. is whether the person, whoever they are, has been the recipient of large sum of funds from Bob Minton. As much as it sucks to deal with the idea, it's just plain human nature that significant financial interests (or the absence thereof) are likely to influence significantly people's opinions. For an outsider like me, this information is an important factor in assessing an account.

    ReplyDelete
  31. Dear R. Hill,

    I post this response with some serious hesitation--not because there's anything to hide, but because what's happening here on Jesse's blog is exactly why I quit posting to the internet 10 years ago.

    To be as honest as I can without starting some kind of flame war, Gerry's account is not totally accurate and yes, I was there when Caroline came to Ken's office in Tampa, but as soon as I post what I know to be true, the back and forth will commence and who's got the time for that? Additionally, once I posted what "I" witnessed at the time, Gerry would feel compelled to negate what I relate and this could only be resolved if I brought Ken on to post or other people who were there at the time and why the heck would I bother those people? Follow? It's very distressing to know the truth--relate the truth and have to keep getting mired down in "noyoudinit" instead of just getting the story out to the best of your ability.

    Writing on Jesse's blog is, for me, a pleasure because I want to support Jesse to finally get his story out without becoming soured by the whole tit-for-tat nit-picking that used to go on way back when we both used to post to the net. That's not to say that I want bogus facts to be propagated without correction. It's just that from MY experience (10 years ago)there's just certain people that spend their entire life on the net and they just seem to beat a point to death like a chihuahua with a chew toy---they just won't let it alone, when in fact it's a "who shot john" that never resolves itself.

    Personally, I had very little time to keep responding to the back and forth, so I just went away. I always figured that, unless you are free to respond to all the back and forth, it's better to just not post. Too many times, years ago, accusations and allegations were hurled at me that I couldn't respond to for weeks (because of time constraints from work and family) and, for those who spend a lot of time on the net, it was considered "ducking" or hiding or worse. And the part that got my goat was that the accusations and allegations were TOTALLY false and I was forced to leave that whole shit storm to propagate on its own and I just didn't have the time or energy to keep defending myself.

    I thought it was kind of cool that Jesse decided to "blog" his story, because rather than post to the newsgroups and message boards where people are all gathered to chat and argue all day, Jesse could roll out his story to the best of his ability without feeling compelled to keep fighting over every detail.

    Granted, I don't have a blog and I don't blog (hell I never even filled out my Facebook page properly), but I was of the opinion that your personal blog was like a journal--a place where you can tell your story without being attacked for your opinions. But maybe I'm mistaken.

    For example: Jesse expressed his opinion here about people who settle lawsuits. He wrote about that here on his personal blog and that was HIS opinion. I wrote a comment expressing MY opinion about people who settle and it differed from Jesse's, but I certainly wouldn't think to attack or demand explanations from Jesse for having an opinion different than mine. It's an OPINION and I, for one, was sad to see Gerry come here to demand that Jesse defend that opinion.

    If my idea of what a blog represents is wrong, then I'll own that, but it just brings back a flood of memories of all the "chew toy" type back and forth that never seemed to resolve itself.

    Note: I think I'm once again surpassing the 4.096 character limit required for these comments so I'll continue in the next (I really need to learn how to condense my thoughts better)

    ReplyDelete
  32. (continued due to verbosity:-P)

    In response to your question though, not every witness signed a non-disclosure--it wasn't necessary for some. Back in those days there were certain netizens who felt compelled to post every move they made and every breath they took. They felt they had "followers" who "needed" to have info on everything they felt, said or did.

    On the other hand there were witnesses who recognized that a court case involving Scientology required a certain amount of discretion and it wasn't necessary to have them sign a NDA. Folks like Hana Whitfield, Frank Oliver, Bill Franks, et al---I'm fairly certain they were not asked to sign an NDA. I can ask Ken to verify. Also I would assume that Jesse didn't sign one either in that he had experience with SCN court cases and knew that it was not sane to discuss details of an ongoing case. But I don't know, I never asked him. All that I know is that all of our witnesses kept details of the case to themselves until after it was finished.

    Because Caroline and Gerry were posting about their life and their everyday experiences full time on the net, we asked Caroline to not discuss anything about the case (while it was ongoing) and she immediately expressed reservations. She told us that "Gerry was her "spiritual guide" and she felt it necessary to share everything with him. We offered her the phone to call Gerry to discuss her decision with him.

    As I recall Caroline was on the phone with Gerry for a very long time when we finally walked back in and asked her what she'd decided. She informed us that she couldn't "hide" anything from Gerry about the ongoing case. So, in order to accomodate her relationship with Gerry we offered her the following: Ask Gerry to sign the NDA as well so that you're free to share the details of the case as it's happening (only with Gerry), but then Gerry will have to agree NOT to discuss what you tell him with anybody.

    She called Gerry back (on speakerphone) and offered him that option. Gerry refused. He told us that he had friends and supporters on the net that EXPECTED to hear details of his life and he refused the deal.

    With that we thanked Caroline for coming to Tampa, and we made arrangements to get her to the airport.

    There was no discussion about the terms outlining repercussions for violating the agreement. Just a general refusal to keep details of the case private. Based on what we were trying to accomplish in court, we needed a certain level of discretion that Caroline and Gerry were not willing to agree to...PERIOD.

    Now that's the facts and quite honestly I can't understand how that could be misconstrued, but it was. There was so much more important stuff going on at the time that this incident was just a blip on the radar screen and certainly nothing that needed further clarification. Honestly, I was surprised to hear it brought up...with a "twist" no less, so many years later.

    I hope that my response answers your question---I have no dog in this fight so my answer is accurate to the best of my ability. I hope it settles this issue, but somehow I doubt it will.

    ReplyDelete
  33. Dear R. Hill,
    I just realized that I didn't answer your question in the last paragraph of your comment.

    Regarding who received large sums of money from Bob:
    First and contrary to crap spewed all over the net, I never received money from Bob. When we made the movie (The Profit), I was paid the same salary by TFC that I always got--even though functioning as producer was far more work than my job as art director/designer ever entailed. As producer I was in charge of getting the sets designed, continuity, wardrobe/costumes, show cars, and all the details that went into shooting a period piece. When the gaffers needed more cable, I ordered it, when the lighting guys needed more gels I procured them.When the wardrobe mistress needed a new steamer, I provided it...you get the idea. It was an exhausting job, but I did it---at the same rate of pay I got as a designer for TFC.

    Jesse was paid as an employee of the LMT...as was Bunker, Teresa Summers, Jeff Jacobson and Ingrid, the receptionist. Bunker, of course got all kinds of camera and recording equipment and, per Bob, occasionally a "bail out" when he ran into difficulties.

    Whereas Gerry, according to Bob, received $100K but I believe that was part of some deal Bob had worked out that Gerry would then donate the money back to the LMT. I'm no tax attorney, but I believe that arrangement was part of a scheme to get funds from Europe back to Bob and the LMT in order to avoid taxes. But you can verify that in the transcripts of Ken's Disqual Hearing.

    Bob did the same thing with Andreas H (of Clambake), but through a surrogate surreptitiously called "the fatman." This was covered in the Disqual hearing transcripts.

    Lerma, on the other hand, per Bob, was always asking for money from Bob. When he wanted to fix up his house, he got money from Bob. When Bob needed to have Lerma convince Wollersheim to drop his case, he gave Lerma another chunk of dough. I have no idea how much money he received from Bob, definitely more than $100K--again you'd have to refer to the transcripts from the Disqual hearing.

    That always puzzled me because Lerma was "personna non grata" at the LMT. Ingrid,the receptionist was given orders by both Bob and Stacy to block incoming calls from Lerma---go figure. Don't ask me-- I'm only relaying what I was told and what I saw.

    Anyway, I certainly wasn't privy to all Bob's financial dealings, but I did hear about the stuff that came out in court.

    I don't know of any other internet posters who got money from Bob---but then again, I don't know who's posting anymore.

    That's all I can remember, but again, most of this came out in Ken's disqual hearing, as well as depositions, so please verify it there within the stuff posted on the net from those legal proceedings.

    Again, I'm relying on memories from years ago, but I'm fairly certain this info is accurate.

    ReplyDelete
  34. Wow Jess and Pat. Thanks for sharing behind the scenes. All the names and info of those who contacted LMT went back to the cult? Ouch!

    ReplyDelete
  35. Dennis,
    Regarding how and what the cult got when Bob gave them the LMT, the best source on that is Ingrid Wagner. She was the receptionist at the LMT and since she lived in Tampa, she was left behind to "guard" the LMT when everybody scattered.

    Since there was a sizable archive in the building, Ingrid was told to await instuctions as to when and where to pack up and ship it.

    There was quite a collection of docs in that archive...gathered from many sources. The most interesting was the archive donated by former Mayor of Clearwater, Gabe Cazares. There was also a massive stash of docs that Bob bought for a sizable chunk of change (I can't remember the name of the guy he bought it from). Aside from those huge archives there was all sorts of newspaper/magazine articles, books, tapes and SCN publications.

    Per Ingrid, the LMT alarm system was still active and she was the designated person the alarm company would call if there was an intrusion.

    One night, somewhere around midnight, the alarm company called her to say there was an intrusion. She called Stacy in Atlanta to ask her what she should do.

    Stacy told her to ignore the call--that Bob had given the building to SCN...period.

    At that moment in time, Ingrid got a wee bit more than pissed. She felt that Stacy had betrayed all the people who'd donated docs to the LMT---because now, the cult had them all and the plan to use them in court cases and to help exers get out was now trashed.

    Ingrid never spoke to Stacy again.

    ReplyDelete
  36. Jesse and Patricia, thank you so much for your words here. It's difficult for me to go back to that time because I felt very betrayed by what happened, but I do appreciate more pieces added to the puzzle.

    ReplyDelete
  37. Lots of info and again nice to see you back Jesse.

    Hugs to all
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    ReplyDelete
  38. Sorry to hear you have not been well Jesse.

    Hope you're well soon.

    ReplyDelete
  39. What is all the death threat crap? Seriously, you have to be a sissy liberal queer to join a self-help alien cult to begin with. Florida good ol boys put laws like the CASTLE DOCTRINE on the books and you libs keep whining about threats? Send them packin in a body bag if they try to kill you. They trad on you because you LET THEM.

    ReplyDelete
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    My name is Mrs Sharon Sim. I live in Singapore and i am a happy woman today? and i told my self that any lender that rescue my family from our poor situation, i will refer any person that is looking for loan to him, he gave me happiness to me and my family, i was in need of a loan of S$250,000.00 to start my life all over as i am a single mother with 3 kids I met this honest and GOD fearing man loan lender that help me with a loan of S$250,000.00 SG. Dollar, he is a GOD fearing man, if you are in need of loan and you will pay back the loan please contact him tell him that is Mrs Sharon, that refer you to him. contact Dr Purva Pius,via email:(urgentloan22@gmail.com) Thank you.

    BORROWERS APPLICATION DETAILS


    1. Name Of Applicant in Full:……..
    2. Telephone Numbers:……….
    3. Address and Location:…….
    4. Amount in request………..
    5. Repayment Period:………..
    6. Purpose Of Loan………….
    7. country…………………
    8. phone…………………..
    9. occupation………………
    10.age/sex…………………
    11.Monthly Income…………..
    12.Email……………..

    Regards.
    Managements
    Email Kindly Contact: urgentloan22@gmail.com

    ReplyDelete
  48. Invest with $100 and get a returns of 5,000$ within seven working days.

    Why wasting your precious time online looking for a loan? When thereis an opportunity for you to invest with $100 and get a returns of5,000$ within seven business working days. Contact us now for moreinformation if interested in learning on how you can earn big withjust little amount. It is all about investing into crude oil and gas.

    Email:jubrininvestment@gmail.com

    ReplyDelete
  49. MRS.IRENE QUERY FINANCE IS THE BEST PLACE TO GET A LOAN {mrsirenequery@gmail.com}

    God bless you Madam, I will not stop telling the world about your kindness in my life, I am a

    single mum with kids to look after. My name is Mrs.Rachel Alex, and I am from Singapore Center

    Drive, Miami Beach, FL . A couple of weeks ago My friend visited me and along our discussion she

    told me about MRS.IRENE QUERY FINANCE, that they can help me out of my financial situation, I

    never believed cause I have spend so much money on different loan lenders who did nothing other

    than running away with my money. I have been in a financial mess for the pass 7 months now,She

    advised I give it a try so I mailed her and explain all about my financial situation to her, she

    therefore took me through the loan process and gave me a loan of $180,000.00 at a very low

    interest rate of 3% and today I am a proud business owner and can now take good care of my kids,

    If you must contact any firm to get any amount of loan you need with a low interest rate of 3%

    and better repayment schedule, please contact MRS.IRENE QUERY FINANCE via email

    {mrsirenequery@gmail.com}

    ReplyDelete
  50. Hello Everybody, My name is Mrs Sharon Sim. I live in Singapore and i am a happy woman today? and i told my self that any lender that rescue my family from our poor situation, i will refer any person that is looking for loan to him, he gave me happiness to me and my family, i was in need of a loan of S$250,000.00 to start my life all over as i am a single mother with 3 kids I met this honest and GOD fearing man loan lender that help me with a loan of S$250,000.00 SG. Dollar, he is a GOD fearing man, if you are in need of loan and you will pay back the loan please contact him tell him that is Mrs Sharon, that refer you to him. contact Dr Purva Pius,via email:(urgentloan22@gmail.com)

    ReplyDelete
  51. MRS. IRENE QUERY FINANCE IS THE BEST PLACE TO GET A LOAN {mrsirenequery@gmail.com}

    God bless you Mum, I will not stop telling the world about your kindness in my life, I am a single mum with kids to look after. My name is Mrs.Rachel Alex, and I am from Singapore . A couple of weeks ago My friend visited me and along our discussion she told me about MRS.IRENE QUERY FINANCE, that they can help me out of my financial situation, I never believed cause I have spend so much money on different loan lenders who did nothing other than running away with my money. I have been in a financial mess for the pass 7 months now,She advised I give it a try so I mailed her and explain all about my financial situation to her, she therefore took me through the loan process and gave me a loan of $180,000.00 at a very low interest rate of 3% and today I am a proud business owner and can now take good care of my kids, If you must contact any firm to get any amount of loan you need with a low interest rate of 3% and better repayment schedule, please contact MRS.IRENE QUERY FINANCE via email{mrsirenequery@gmail.com}

    ReplyDelete
  52. My name is.Mrs.Juliet Quin. I live in Canada and i am a happy woman today? and i told my self that any lender that rescue my family from our poor situation, i will refer any person that is looking for loan to him, he gave me happiness to me and my family, i was in need of a loan of $ 73,000.00 to start my life all over as i am a single mother with 3 kids I met this honest and GOD fearing man loan lender that help me with a loan of $ 73,000.00 Canada Dollar, he is a GOD fearing man, if you are in need of loan and you will pay back the loan please contact him tell him that is Mrs.Juliet Quin that refer you to him. Contact Dr Purva Pius via email: reply to email (urgentloan22@gmail.com)

    ReplyDelete
  53. Hello Everybody,
    My name is Ahmad Asnul Brunei, I contacted Mr Osman Loan Firm for a business loan amount of $250,000, Then i was told about the step of approving my requested loan amount, after taking the risk again because i was so much desperate of setting up a business to my greatest surprise, the loan amount was credited to my bank account within 24 banking hours without any stress of getting my loan. I was surprise because i was first fall a victim of scam! If you are interested of securing any loan amount & you are located in any country, I'll advise you can contact Mr Osman Loan Firm via email osmanloanserves@gmail.com

    LOAN APPLICATION INFORMATION FORM
    First name......
    Middle name.....
    2) Gender:.........
    3) Loan Amount Needed:.........
    4) Loan Duration:.........
    5) Country:.........
    6) Home Address:.........
    7) Mobile Number:.........
    8) Email address..........
    9) Monthly Income:.....................
    10) Occupation:...........................
    11)Which site did you here about us.....................
    Thanks and Best Regards.
    Derek Email osmanloanserves@gmail.com

    ReplyDelete
  54. MRS. IRENE QUERY FINANCE IS THE BEST PLACE TO GET A LOAN {mrsirenequery@gmail.com}

    God bless you Mum, I will not stop telling the world about your kindness in my life, I am a single mum with kids to look after. My name is Mrs.Rachel Alex, and I am from Singapore . A couple of weeks ago My friend visited me and along our discussion she told me about MRS.IRENE QUERY FINANCE, that they can help me out of my financial situation, I never believed cause I have spend so much money on different loan lenders who did nothing other than running away with my money. I have been in a financial mess for the pass 7 months now,She advised I give it a try so I mailed her and explain all about my financial situation to her, she therefore took me through the loan process and gave me a loan of $180,000.00 at a very low interest rate of 3% and today I am a proud business owner and can now take good care of my kids, If you must contact any firm to get any amount of loan you need with a low interest rate of 3% and better repayment schedule, please contact MRS.IRENE QUERY FINANCE via email{mrsirenequery@gmail.com}

    ReplyDelete
  55. Adakah anda memerlukan pinjaman kredit kewangan yang mendesak?
    * Pemindahan Sangat cepat dan serta-merta ke akaun bank anda
    * Bayaran balik bermula lapan bulan selepas anda mendapatkan wang
    akaun bank
    * Kadar faedah yang rendah sebanyak 2%
    * Bayaran balik jangka panjang (1-30 tahun) Panjang
    * Syarat-syarat pinjaman yang fleksibel dan bayaran bulanan
    *. Berapa lama masa yang diambil untuk membiayai? Selepas mengemukakan permohonan pinjaman
    Anda boleh mengharapkan jawapan awal kurang daripada 24 jam
    pembiayaan dalam 72-96 jam selepas menerima maklumat yang mereka perlukan
    dari awak.

    Hubungi syarikat ini sah dan berlesen, yang diberi kuasa
    untuk memberi bantuan kewangan kepada orang
    Maklumat dan permohonan pinjaman lebih bentuk

    emel: cashfirmarena@gmail.com


    Selamat sejahtera
    Sir Joel Williams
    FIRM TUNAI PINJAMAN SYARIKAT
    Ketua Pegawai Eksekutif
    Tel: +601111850392
    Email: cashfirmarena@gmail.com
    Webisite: cashfirmarena.wordpress.com

    ReplyDelete
  56. Adakah anda memerlukan pinjaman kredit kewangan yang mendesak?
    * Pemindahan Sangat cepat dan serta-merta ke akaun bank anda
    * Bayaran balik bermula lapan bulan selepas anda mendapatkan wang
    akaun bank
    * Kadar faedah yang rendah sebanyak 2%
    * Bayaran balik jangka panjang (1-30 tahun) Panjang
    * Syarat-syarat pinjaman yang fleksibel dan bayaran bulanan
    *. Berapa lama masa yang diambil untuk membiayai? Selepas mengemukakan permohonan pinjaman
    Anda boleh mengharapkan jawapan awal kurang daripada 24 jam
    pembiayaan dalam 72-96 jam selepas menerima maklumat yang mereka perlukan
    dari awak.

    Hubungi syarikat ini sah dan berlesen, yang diberi kuasa
    untuk memberi bantuan kewangan kepada orang
    Maklumat dan permohonan pinjaman lebih bentuk

    emel: cashfirmarena@gmail.com


    Selamat sejahtera
    Sir Joel Williams
    FIRM TUNAI PINJAMAN SYARIKAT
    Ketua Pegawai Eksekutif
    Tel: +601111850392
    Email: cashfirmarena@gmail.com
    Webisite: cashfirmarena.wordpress.com

    ReplyDelete
  57. Adakah anda memerlukan pinjaman kredit kewangan yang mendesak?
    * Pemindahan Sangat cepat dan serta-merta ke akaun bank anda
    * Bayaran balik bermula lapan bulan selepas anda mendapatkan wang
    akaun bank
    * Kadar faedah yang rendah sebanyak 2%
    * Bayaran balik jangka panjang (1-30 tahun) Panjang
    * Syarat-syarat pinjaman yang fleksibel dan bayaran bulanan
    *. Berapa lama masa yang diambil untuk membiayai? Selepas mengemukakan permohonan pinjaman
    Anda boleh mengharapkan jawapan awal kurang daripada 24 jam
    pembiayaan dalam 72-96 jam selepas menerima maklumat yang mereka perlukan
    dari awak.

    Hubungi syarikat ini sah dan berlesen, yang diberi kuasa
    untuk memberi bantuan kewangan kepada orang
    Maklumat dan permohonan pinjaman lebih bentuk

    emel: cashfirmarena@gmail.com


    Selamat sejahtera
    Sir Joel Williams
    FIRM TUNAI PINJAMAN SYARIKAT
    Ketua Pegawai Eksekutif
    Tel: +601111850392
    Email: cashfirmarena@gmail.com
    Webisite: cashfirmarena.wordpress.com

    ReplyDelete
  58. testimony testimony testimony,
    My name is keith Hargroven,i am here to testify how i got my mortgage from MR samsul Alam LOANS FIRM after i applied several times from various mortgage lenders. I was in need of an urgent mortgage to start a business and i applied from various mortgage lenders who promised to help but they never give me the mortgage.Until a friend of mine introduce me to MR Samsul Alam who promised to help me and indeed he did as he promised without any form of delay.I never thought there are still reliable mortgage lenders until i meet MR Samsul Alam ,who are indeed helped with the mortgage and changed my believe. I don't know if you are in any way in need of a genuine and urgent mortgage,feel free to contact ,MR Samsul Alam via their Company Email:{Samsulalamcashfirm@gmail.com}

    ReplyDelete
  59. Do you need Personal Loan?
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    Application Form:
    =================
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    Email us(flourishloancredite@gmail.com)

    ReplyDelete
  60. Our Company work according to clear, flexible, transparent and easy to understand terms. We offer very low interest rates in relation to the slowdown of economic activity (recession) in most countries in the world. You may have bad credit, Our company now offers affordable interest rate loan, so what do you need funds to boost your business? Or are you in need of money for some personal purposes? Why not contact us now that we offer individuals and legal loans at an interest rate of 3% for a maximum period of 25 years. Interested applicant can contact us via e-mail now: paulsonloaninvestment@gmail.com

    ReplyDelete